Tuesday, May 20, 2008

PEAK OIL REVISTED

by Murph

I am reasonably sure that everyone that comes to this site is aware of the concept of peak oil, that is, the maximum production of crude oil world wide, and it infers that from that point on, there will be less oil extracted from the ground.

Lately, I have been running into information about peak oil that is casting some question about its validity. I recently had this site sent to me;

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3340274697167011147&hl=en

It is a long movie, around 75 minutes, of a lecture by Lindsy Williams who allegedly spent a number of years at the Alaska oil operations and wrote a book debunking peak oil. This lecture was delivered to The Granada Forum. Williams is a Baptist preacher that spent much of his time as a missionary. I gathered that he was figuring to take the word of God to those poor men working in the oil fields and add their souls to the list of saved. In the lecture, he didn’t mention how successful he was at this. The lecture was concerned with what he learned from the few years he was there. He says that he learned that there is enough oil in Alaska to supply the U.S. for 200 years at our present rate of usage. He says that the oil find has been squelched by the government because if they started pumping oil that the price would drop dramatically and cause the immediate collapse of the American economy. He further maintains that the cost of extraction alone domestically is $3 per barrel and the cost of extraction alone in Arab oil fields is $5 per barrel. He also maintains that the high price of oil enabled the World Bank and the IMF to forgive the 3rd world countries their debt by having us pay for it through this high price. He also says that the World Bank owns the entire Amazon basin, where they have oil. Williams quotes a lot of other statistics but the whole emphasis was that there is a whole lot more oil available for domestic production than the government will admit to, namely that the oil available in Alaska exceed the size of the Arab oil fields.

Williams delivers his lecture in the style of a Baptist preacher and the whole thing could have been condensed down to 30 minutes. If you sit down and think about what he said and hopefully took some notes on it, there are a bunch of questions he never talks about. Give it a listen and see what you think. He claims that he was taken into the confidence of the big oil executives and they told him all of this stuff. Does that make sense to you?

Richard Heinberg has a post up concerning abiotic oil that is interesting.

http://www.energybulletin.net/2423.html

In this article he contends that the abiotic oil people simply have not proven their case, and sites a lot of data to warrant his attack.

I also found an interesting article on the genesis of oil.

http://www.wnd.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=47448

Here is another article concerning abiotic oil

http://worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=45838

Here is an article by John Hofmeister oil executive who says Matt Simmons is dead wrong about peak oil.

http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=59502

Among the problems facing this tired old world, I for one have no desire to spend time being concerned with something that is not true. But, this whole peak oil controversy is a mute point in my view. Even if there is 500 years of oil available, so what? The PTB seemingly are restricting the availability of the stuff and it might as well be peak oil in fact. I presume you are aware of the current prices for gas and the downward statitics for extraction and the loss of refineries in this country. Down from over 300 in the 80’s to less than 150 today. Another point; unless abiotic oil is for real, it is still a finite resource and to continue the escalating usage of it to build an empire means that when we do run out of extractable oil, it will just be that much worse in the future.

I have the view that the worst thing that could happen for this world is the finding of large quantities of crude oil that could be extracted easily. Do we really want to continue destroying the environment and peoples lives with the stuff? It most assuredly appears to me that as long as oil is plentiful that is exactly what will happen and the world’s population will just keep on increasing. Of course, this is not even beginning to talk about peak everything else either. 500 years of oil will not provide fresh water for agriculture. So many of the world’s populations seem to think that humans can live in an entirely self contained sterile world and the environment and all it contains be damned. But oh what the hell, two alternatives here. Use up everything on this earth trying to raise everybody to the same living standards of the U.S. and Europe or depress everybody to third world living standards or below with the elites in charge of it all.

You will notice that none of the presidential candidates seem willing to address these kinds of problems. It’s still business as usual for all of them. We are doomed either way I tell you, doomed!!

43 comments:

stoney13 said...

I've got a friend we call "Cowboy" who is a member of The Cherokee People. He worked in Alaska for years in the oil fields, and just for shits and giggles, I gave him a call a few minutes ago, and ran this scenario past him.

According to him, there is plenty, and I mean PLENTY of oil in Alaska! This oil crunch is just a ploy by Big Oil to get the price up, and to get the ANWR opened up!

If this country wanted to, ALL the domestic oil needs could be easily supported by domestic sources! This whole sad scenario is nothing but market manipulation with the blessings of the government!

The whole thing with the Saudi Arabian oil is nothing but bullshit! We don't need it! In fact, most of the oil imported into the United States comes from CANADA!!! The REAL kicker is that CANADA ISN'T EVEN A MEMBER OF OPEC!!!!!! OPEC is nothing but a "good ol' boys club" run by The House Of Saud! When we hear talk of OPEC, what we're REALLY hearing is the whims, of Saudi Arabia, who cracks the whip!!

Yea there's no talk from the candidates about any long term solutions concerning the oil shortage! There's a damned good reason for that! THERE AIN'T NO FUCKING OIL SHORTAGE!!! The oil crunch is just a nice fat feast laid for the House of Saud by President Pork Pie as penance for going into Iraq, when Saudi Arabia told us to keep the fuck out!

Bush fucked this country up REAL BAD! The scary thing is, that nobody knows just how bad! I can give a partial accounting that I've been working on, but since the figures change daily, this is just an estimate, and a low-ball one at that!

Daily tab for Iraq $275 million

Missing money, $9 billion
(including $1.4 for
Halliburton!)

Blackwater's cut $1 billion

Pissed off yet? Well! Here's the Really SCARY NUMBERS!!

Subsidies for Big Oil $397 Billion
in 2008 alone

Mortgage crisis $519 Billion
cost to homeowners

And now for the kicker:
ESTIMATED NATIONAL DEBT
AS OF 1/3/2009 $9.4 TRILLION

GOT YOUR PITCHFORKS READY, PEOPLE?

murph said...

Stoney,

The numbers you gave on the economic situation I have seen before from multiple sources. Probably true.

I'm not sure about the oil thing. Unless you were in the top execs clubhouse, how could you be sure? But, again, if it is true, it will not be good for us in the end.

stoney13 said...

Murph,

No such thing as a sure thing, that's true! But one can still make deductions based on available information.

Here's a nice map of Iraqi oil reserves! This map is quite interesting because it was on the table at "Darth Cheney's" super secret hush-hush "Energy Task Force" meeting of 2001. Cut and paste "IraqOilMap.pdf (application/pdf Object)" in your browser's address bar, and it will take you right to it.

This is relevant, because Judicial Watch got this map from this meeting in 2003 from the Commerce Department under court order stemming from a FOI lawsuit in 2003. This map, (and other documents dated March 2001) were on the table when Darth Cheney, and Big Oil's Golden Boys had their little pow-wow! What was said, and who said what is protected by right of privacy, but the documents DO show who was there, and what they had on the table.

From this document, we can deduce that Iraq's oil reserves were being discussed by Big Oil WAY before the 2003 invasion! Now let's put that on simmer for a while, and go to 2000 when Big Oil shoveled FAT coin into Bush's campaign for the presidency.

What did Big Oil want for this investment? They wanted ANWR opened up for drilling! Not because they needed it! Just because it was something they couldn't have at the time, and they wanted it! And Bush was given the task of getting it for them!

After the first unsuccessful attempts, Darth Cheney held his secret meeting with Big Oil, and the steady climb to $4.00 a gallon gas began. America got it's first glimpse of things to come.

Bush's approval rating started to slip. Cheney refused to let the rest of the country in on what the meeting was all about, and who was there!

All of a sudden 9/11! Saudi Arabians hijacked airplanes, and crashed them into The World Trade Center! Of course this would be blamed on Afghanistan, even though not one hijacker was traced to Afghanistan, (and nobody danced in the streets in Afghanistan like they did in Saudi Arabia). Overnight, the whole dynamic changed! Terrorism scenarios, and American flags popped out of the woodwork. Bush's approval rating sored into the stratosphere, and Bush was given Carde Blanche to do whatever his little heart desired to whoever the fuck he wanted to!

Detailed plans that were put on Bush's desk on September 9 2001, (two days before the 9/11 attack) were immediately implemented, and Afghanistan was invaded on October 8 2001.

Meanwhile back in Iraq, Saddam Husein was tying to get the sanctions from 1990 dropped by the UN Security Council, which would lead to all that Iraqi oil hitting the market and flooding the market!

This would piss all over Big Oils' plans for ANWR, and Bush just had to do something, so steps were taken that would lead us into the events of May 1 2003, which we all know well enough!

Now to the present! A mere three weeks ago, Bush tried once again to get ANWR opened up for drilling. Glenn Beck started selling T shirts proposing that we "Drill right through reindeer's skulls" and other such misguided actions. None of which bore fruit.

Last week, Pork Pie flew to Saudi Arabia to beg the House of Saud to step up production to get the price of oil down. Guess what? DIDN'T HAPPEN!

Before this little trip, you can be assured that Bush put this plan his buddies in Big Oil. You can also be assured that it didn't happen! Why? Simple! Why fly to foreign lands, when we can get the same thing here!

The Rethuglicans NEED oil to go down! They need it to go down to keep them from getting their asses handed to them in the upcoming elections!

Problem is, Big Oil likes all that fat coin! They aren't suffering! If they were, then their profit margins would be unchanged, but check them out! Record profits across the board!

You see, oil is traded on the "Commodities Futures" market. Just like pork bellies, apples, oranges, and everything else in this country. Available supply dictates the price of goods, so if you can control the supply, you control the price! Big Oil controls the supply! Every military action taken by the Bush Administration allows them to do just that!

Now Bush wants to put all those snakes back in the bag, and he can't! Just Like Frankenstein, the Republicans' monster stands poised to to destroy them! And the scary thing is, they'll take us down with them!

Anonymous said...

Murph and Freeacre,
I too live in Central Oregon. It is good to know that a few fellow Central Oregonians feel the same way I do. I have been watching this all happen for a long time. I sent the link to the video of Lindsey Williams to a lot of people on my email list. I wished it would open their eyes.
kepmefre

Anonymous said...

kepmefre,

Problem is that we can't really verify what Lindsey said in that film. It could be misinformation of the highest order. Then again, if it's true, and what he asserts will happen if they opened it up means a whole different scenario.

Again I assert, it will be devastating to civilization to find more oil in large amounts. All it would do is prolong the misery for most of us and when we truly ran out, it will be far worse than it is now or the near future if oil becomes more expensive.

I have yet to see anything from an oil geologist to the effect that there is that much oil in Alaska.

Of course, if there is that much oil there, and if they go after it, it will be sold on the open market, not necessarily in the U.S. If all the other oil fields are indeed in decline, I would imagine there wouldn't be much in lowering the price.

No matter how you cut it, I simply have no idea any more who to believe but I would rather prepare for something that doesn't happen than not prepare and have it come down. We shall see.

murph said...

murph made the above comment.

murph said...

kepmefre

By the way welcome. Don't believe you have commented before. Pull up a log by the campfire and pass the talking stick.

Anonymous said...

Interesting post. Perhaps the Baptist was plugged with propaganda to keep the myth alive so we'd keep buying big cars and pumping lots of gas. Odd thing though that no new "mega fields",
100 Million BPD, have come on line in 2008. None. When in 07 there were supposedly 3, in 2006 there were 11 and 18 mega fields on line in 05. And supposedly it takes 6 years to bring to market once it's discovered. If some one has discoverd a huge pile of oil they'd better start getting it ready or just a few strategic Katrinas could throw us all into horse and buggies. I think there's no question that we're tettering on the brink of several mis-calculations and Murph is right if one doesn't get us the other one will. mrsp

One thing you can count on, the PTB will never want us (the masses) to know the truth. Revolt and panic might insue.

Anonymous said...

Yeah, Murph. It could be the DeBeers tactic. Control ALL of the oil fields, pipelines, etc, keep everything secret -or speculative and fix prices. I hope you're wrong about Alaska. I really don't want to see the world motoring till there's no clean air or water left and world looks like "Solent Green." But it its's true, then I believe it's the PTB deciding to cull the heard. Starve a few million people to death and blame it on scarce energy. Yep, we be doomed alright.

Dude

Anonymous said...

Freeacre and Stoney,

Thanks for your kind words on the poem, last post. I'm not satisfied with the ending, but I can work on that.

Haven't read this guy who claims the US is sitting on 200 years-worth of oil, but I'm sure that rosy delusion will temp many in America to buy his book.

Stoney, I found this article on rense.com. Truthers-The Moral Equivalent Of Our Founding Fathers, by Douglas Herman, 5-21-8. I thought of you when I read it. Herman says exactly what I have been feeling, but could not state as concisely as he does. Excellent piece to save.

Also, just as a heads-up, check out the article on Last Roundup-Main Core, on Cryptogon.

Hope not to see any of you at 'camp' this summer.

-rp

Anonymous said...

Regarding mans never ending pursuit for oil and what we as humans are willing to give up to have the conveniences that oil economies can provide here is a recent article about the tar sands project I found interesting.... have to break it down to fit .... disculpe

http://www.motherjones.com/news/feature/
2008/05/scenes-from-the-tar-wars.html


Ely

Anonymous said...

You may be ignoring what is right before your eyes. You said it. Oil is going to be the least of our worries. You can't eat it.
Why should big oil expand to fuel a world economy that they know is unsustainable?
How best to ensure world dominance than to creat a shortage, jack up prices, collect the money, and move onto the next big opportunity.
Who is buying up all the farmland in the world?
How many bullets does it take to protect a bag of beans after they have put us all in the poor house?
Forget about oil. Fresh water is the pure gold of the future. Got any???

LC

Anonymous said...

Murph and Freeacre,
I'm not good at this posting on blogs. This is only the second time for me to do it. I tried a little while ago and I don't think it worked.
I just thought that Lindsey Williams had some good points about the powers that are running things behind the scenes. They would like to go after Iran and are probably trying to figure out how to lead the sheeple into believing we need to go there.
Just look at the 3 top choices they want you to vote on for president. It's pretty pathetic.
I'm sure they do control all the major networks and most people buy everything they see on TV. I guess thats why they call it programing.
I think if you could see under the chair that Bill Oreilly sets on you could see Ruppert Murdock's hand stuffed up his ass wiggling his fingers like a hand puppet.
They have all jumped on this green movement like it is the greatest thing. Please don't get me wrong I think that it is everyones responsibility to take care of the land we live on and the air we breath but I'm worried that it is more about freedom restrictions and global taxation then taking care of the environment, especially when you look at other countries that don't worry about being green.
They want us off of their land and in the cities or else in their internment camps if we don't cooperate. Thanks for letting me vent.
kepmefre

murph said...

Ely,

That article is depressing at best, Personally I feel a rage about what is going on up there.

murph said...

LC

Thanks for the comment. You are right, fresh water is the next biggie. In fact, in our area we are fighting over this and have been for about 2 years now. |The local rulers and princes are determined to drive all us folks out of the area so they can have one of the last big big sources of fresh water left in this country at their disposal, and it is all at the federal level.

murph said...

kepmefre,

Venting is good for us since that is about all we have left and can have no effect on what is happening. You have taken the talking stick and let it happen again. Word needs to get out to all that will listen.

Your right that Williams had some good points. The question in my mind is what agenda is he following and under whose influence? Is his data actually correct or was he fed misinformation?

Some of what he said matches up with other sources of information and some of it doesn't. I would encourage anyone listening to him cross check with other sources what he said. I for one have great mistrust of some of what he said. Plus, he is a Baptist missionary which increases my distrust dramatically. Those people I put pretty much in the same category as the neo-cons.

Anonymous said...

Well I have watched the video....long video to convey his particular message.

I am not familiar with this Lindsey Williams, but I listen to him and I have to say I am skeptical at what his motives might be. Sure he is pointing out that there are powers that be that are in control and will continue in that role. Whether or not they are covering up important quantity data that would silence the peak oil proponents all I can say is that it is his presentation.

I guess what gets me a little raw is that instead of people like Williams getting up on their particular soap box and demanding we open up vast reserves of untouched oil, {if this in fact is the case and I for one am not convinced that there are these huge reserves}, with it a return to a dollar a gallon gasoline, why don't they put that same fire and brimstone passionate effort into preaching about resource based energy such as wind, solar, ocean current technologies to get away from a pollutant based resource such as oil.

Personally I think that sky high prices for oil and gas might actually get people thinking about how we are destroying the very rock we all share. Take a look at the article I posted previous, that is what is taking place because of high oil price, however the price for that region will be much higher for the communities the environment and anything else that has to share that part of the world. Destroying what at one time was a pristine part of the globe for the sake of oil...

Perhaps the next crop of engineering students should be required to do in depth study of energy pioneers such as Tesla, Moray, Schauberger and there are many others who believed that we have access to unlimited energy we need only to work on tapping into that resource.

The use of oil for an energy source should have been at best a brief chapter to achieving a long term clean energy supply solution.

Yes Murph what is happening in Northern Alberta is nothing short of criminal... greed greed and more greed

The planet needs a global reset bring on Nibiru!!! LOL

Ely

murph said...

Ely,

I'd like to comment a bit on your talking about renewable energy sources.

All the stuff that is currently being developed in that area is not actually renewable or sustainable. And for many of them, we have absolutely no reliable data on long term consequences.

General statement is in order. When you extract one form of energy into another, something is going to change. Two example; Wind and wave energy. In both we are extracting one energy source and turning it into electricity. In the case of wind energy, that extraction is going to have an environmental impact. The energy contained in the movement of air is way influencing on climate. We draw down that energy level and what are the climate changes? We have no idea.

Wave energy is the same. How would it change ocean currents and related parts of ocean energy? We don't know.

Damming rivers has done the same thing. Extensive environmental degradation from doing that.

Plus, none of this is taking into account the energy sources needed to build the infrastructure. What is the true cost in money and resources to build these huge wind turbines, or the monolithic structures for wave energy?

This does not include the historical fact that as energy use goes up, so does population, thus demanding more energy source.

If some of the experimental and far out developments of "free energy" actually turn out to be viable and are developed, up goes the population. And the infrastructure to make the mechanisms to harness the "free energy" and their total cost in resources and environment degradation to do so hasn't been discussed.

My god, according to Williams, it cost a max of $5 to extract a barrel of oil. This cost doesn't include the infrastructure cost nor the cost to the environment. How much closer to free can we get? And look what that cheap energy has done to this world.

If we are to believe the scientists that spend their lives studying this stuff, we may already have reached a tip over point of no return and putting up more low cost or "free energy" isn't going to solve the problem. At least that is how I analyze it.

freeacre said...

I am so glad to hear from new voices on the blog like LC, kepmefre, more from Dude and Ely and Russell. This is a busy time for a lot of us, with work and planting and all that keeps us from being able to express ourselves regularly right now. But, as we know, it is the comments that are the real strength of this site. According to the stats on this blog, we have about 270 or more readers on this site per week from all over the world. Together, we form a sort of vanguard of people who are struggling to create a new paradigm as to how to cope with the challenges we face, and how to reach out and communicate what we find works and what doesn't. It is empowering to have a forum to express our thoughts and feelings and link up with others to keep our spirits up. I encourage all those who read the posts to make comments and pick up the slack when the regulars are temporarily unable to add to the conversation for various reasons. Murph and I write on different topics mostly to stimulate conversation. All of us need to become leaders in the communities where we live. When the shit hits the fan, there is going to be a lot of confusion and panic, and it will fall to the ones who have been thinking of these things for awhile to provide some clear thinking to those around us.
We just received Dmitri Orlav's book, "Reinventing Collapse" from Amazon. I'm about half way through it, and it is GREAT. A must read. I wish I had the money to buy about a hundred of them and give them away.
One of the strengths of this country, I think, is that Americans for the most part really are pretty nice people who are capable of great kindness and generosity that they are willing to extend to strangers. Maybe because we move so much and make friends easier than a lot of other family and place based oriented cultures. Even here in cyberspace, this campfire has been created and those who sit and listen to each others council, as diverse as it is, have formed real friendships and have become very important to each other. I think about this tribe of troutpeople who are my hope and inspiration during each day and bless you all before going to sleep.
All I can say is you are welcome here. We value your input. The more eyes and ears and hearts and minds, the better.
aho

freeacre said...

Oh, just another little piece - Our weather has just changed from 90 degrees to the 50's again with frost at night. AAARRRGH! Lost 4 tomato plants IN THE GREENHOUSE WITH 2 HEATERS GOING!! So, now we got these new garden warming blankets from Territorial Seed Company (Google it) that are supposed to protect plants down to 24 degrees. Got enuf to cover the whole garden and have put flannel sheets on the stuff in the greenhouse. That seems to be working so far. Like it's not bad enuf that our ground is made of 30 feet of volcanic ash with almost no nutrients... now it has to freeze at night, too. But, every place has it's own challenges and we are just going to have to learn to deal with them. At least there's not a lot of bugs (no offense to Langosta).

Anonymous said...

Freeacre,
I'm fairly new at gardening and my yard here in N.E. Bend is in a 16 year old subdivision. The soil is basically sand (crushed basalt)with turf rolled over it. I did raise a few tomato plants last year with good results after the frost was gone. One of my problems is that if I would of had time to pay attention to how my house is situated on my property, as to how the sun rises and sets I would have looked for something different. The wrong side of the house gets the sunlight. No yard. So I'm going to try container gardening. At least that way I can move them if I have to. You got to do what you got to do. I moved here about 8.5 years ago from 130 miles east 2 days before Christmas. It's not a bad place to live although some of the population makes me crazy. I believe that we will all end up trying to do a lot of things for our selfs that a lot of people aren't used to. I think that there are a lot of people in for a real reality check and some that think they have a lot of money will find that they are as broke as the rest of us. I guess thats leveling the playing field.
Do any of you folks on here subscribe to Edgar J. Steele at www.ConspiracyPenPal.com
he is pretty interesting.
kepmefre

Anonymous said...

langosta loves you freeacre,and says no offense could ever be imagined coming from you, she says she loves you as a true sister and that it is a girl thing regardless of how many antenna you have.

offering these words this a.m unknowing that the world has gone on since the dream state and a new post has arisen from the ashes of the past. so with belated offerings here it is. it pertains to the post even though seemingly only slightly,it comes from langosta and is a subject that this one stumbles upon with ever increasing fervor. one stands between the past and the future embedded as in a crystal of shining spirit and questions flow and the answers only bring forth more questions.

the topics at this council are as varied as the brothers and sisters that attend but they all are concerned with one root it seems and that is trying to get a handle on the future, my own crystal ball resides in the dream sleep of a cricket whom happens to be also my main spirit guide, in our native culture it is one of those quests for us to be fortunate enough to be blessed with at least one, as it happens sometimes for whatever reason one might have several, as in our way one might get answers from just being in the presence of trees as one walks through the forest, or from the sound of a splashing brook, it really makes no difference, what is important at least to the receiver are these invitations to attend and they are always invitations and come sometimes in a most unimaginable and difficult form.
anyway i was chatting with langosta and she offered up words without a question before this post went up, this is unusual,,she says that the future is actually here and now, same as the past and so can be presented .... this is what she said...



bug says that good fortune is sometimes an awesome burden, explain i ask, what happens she says is that people are more comfortable in their everyday existence even though it is pitiful, this in itself keeps change from coming, our habitual wasteland is very valuable to us, even though the gift of the spirit always awaits command, and would spring people from the wasteland that they accept as life. i sill do not understand what you say i says, well for instance she says, occasionally by what you call luck or accident someone will win the lottery, this step which seems out of time is if you think about it much of the time occurs to people that are of a nature to live in trailer villages and such, and the enormous amount of money received allows a person to indulge in every form of gluttony including so called drugs and life becomes even more desperate then before, it is a common story really, and also there is essentially no difference between good fortune and bad fortune, both are a gift of the spirit asked for by the recipient even if conscientiously unseen as ones own desire, these gifts bring with them the possibility of evolution of the spirit and would bring one even closer to the source if understood that the supposed experiences might be examined on an internal level as sole and substance of ones own making.
there was a time she says in the past eons that the children of the spirit did not have this in there world, there was no need and even though there are small isolated pockets of these children today they will soon understand that their lives hang in a very delicate balance for the greed of man intends to obliterate all the living things of this planet and it is to late to change this for mankind is a failed experiment and must parish for the sake of the survival of all the other creatures that dwell among you.
bullshit i says, how can you say that,? she says look around you, what is there in the making of your actual experience that you would really want to hold onto? your kind either have or are in the process of destroying all that is beautiful on the only home you know, and this goes on at an accelerated rate and there is no stopping it until the last human is gone from the face of the earth.
this is the unconscience desire of mankind, for mankind is wrapped so tightly in self=hatred and denial that the love that mankind could have has on its neck the boot of humans and there is no relief from this, at least not enough to make a difference.... wait i says, all of humanity is not greed and lust for power, what about them,? she smiles at me and a tenderness of peace and serenity pervades the space and there are no words that flow from her, only a perfume of love and some thing that i cannot describe, for there are no words,


i feel that something great is happening and that we are on the verge of an awaking that will shake at least a few of us to the roots of our being, and that we will realize of whom and what we actually are, not who we think we are, if indeed there is any thinking about it at all which is highly unlikely.like the brother says, TV ain't a program its a programer!!
i think that the brothers and sisters that attend this council fire and fires of similar nature around our mother earth are lights in the darkness and that the miracle of desire emanating from us as self love only wish to share what we have found, to squash out the debauchery of scarcity and to know and understand that the world that we have found is a reaching out for our true home which is if you stand on a clear moonless night and look up at the points of light long enough the emotion of ........well, you know.
i wish i could hold the hands of all that attend this sacred place, and maybe some day by the miracle of our own self expression this will be made possible.
i rest in peace i love you
aho
langosta & mf

ps to those of you that have recently given this council the honor of taking the talking stick and voiced your presence, welcome to this sacred meeting place, and i hope you have found this place a place where your words are honored regardless of whether there is agreement or disagreement for what is said here,for one is no more important then the other. what is important is that you have found a warm place by the fire and that we keep it alive by our love for one another. so please feel free to explore your own ideas and thoughts and present them here for us all to delight in/
peace

Anonymous said...

Murph your points are well taken...

I apologize cause this is a little longer than I normally write...

I think the point I was trying to make is that while Williams is lamenting that the PTB are controlling in such a way the general population of the world is at their particular whim or at their mercy, I would like to see some of these groups use their energies to take away some of that control, if indeed that control is through oil, then perhaps less dependency on oil should be their call to arms and not more dependancy.

Regarding your comment on wind and wave energy. I agree with you. We do not presently know what the affect these energy sources may or may not have on the present environment. It will not matter though to what ever type of energy source we as humans devise we will leave an indelible footprint on this planet. My only background concerning wind energy is that I worked in an area of the provinces of Saskatchewan and in Alberta where there is now extensive use off wind turbines. What I can tell you is that in those areas it was always damn windy before wind turbines and continues to be damn windy after turbines. So to convince me that they can affect wind to the extent of changing anything except the look of the overall landscape I would need to see a lot more data. This is not to say that these farms should be put up any place a corporation desires, hell no, they should be in areas that would be of minimal impact to the environment rules of which o this day are not being followed. The same would go for wave energy and the collection of solar.
If we can propel ourselves into outer space then I think we should have the mental capability to study where best to situate any such energy sources.

As far as cost of infrastructure you are going to have to inherit that cost regardless whether or not it is a trans continental pipeline or connecting to the grid. Equipment associated with the extraction of oil and gas or installing wind turbines or solar panels is all hard capital cost and it does not matter, you cannot escape those costs.

Now if we get back to the scientific community for a minute. This is the same community that championed that Telsa was a crackpot. It did not matter at all to them that there are probably hundreds of items to this day which affect their very lifestyles that if you look back can be attributed in some way to an idea by Tesla, yet they state emphatically that his ideas of harnessing the power source available in the ionosphere is nothing short of being mental. They will admit we are awash in energy, it is all around us but they stop short of listening too closely for ways in which we can harness that energy. The same was said for Moray....

Damning rivers is an atrocity that Victor Schauberger warned about a hundred years ago. He even went so far as to offer alternative ways to utilize the flow of water to create energy and not de-vitalize the living water but again was stymied by the engineering groups, the politicians and power brokers of the day. Once again it did not matter that most of his ideas did in fact prove out... they had other agendas.

We as humans have to start to look at ways other than what we presently have to reduce the dependence on oil and gas for energy. This is not just for the sake of rising energy cost but for our very existence on this planet. We cannot continue to use energy that is treacherous for our ability to survive. It should not matter one lick that if they open up the North Slope of Alaska, Poke Holes in the Anwar region and gasoline returns to less than 2 bucks a gallon. What will that solve? In most cases it will once again justify to some that driving a Hummer or an F350 dually to church and the supermarket is an alright thing to do. It will not help to reduce the fact that the USA is approx 5% of the world population but continues to belly up to the trough to deem entitlement to over a quarter of the worlds energy resources????

What Williams proposes in my mind is just that. Make the gasoline cheap so the American way of life can continue, to hell with the eventuality of this planet. In this sense he and others that follow him are no better than the PTB that he is railing against.

Lets start to think again of infrastructure such as rail systems that can carry vast quantities of goods and people at a fraction of the energy required. Let us start to explore ideas that at one time were stymied because of large corporate interests. Lets open our minds up past that which restricts our thinking that maybe just maybe there are other methods of energy extraction than what we see at present.

Now as far as the increasing population due to cheaper energy... not sure what to say to that. I think population like everything else needs some sort of regulation. I have always said you have to have a permit to drive, permits to build, permits to basically wipe your arse and yet you are free to carelessly populate the earth. Raising children to be fine upstanding people is perhaps the most important task you will do in this life and yet even the most brainless idiotic individuals can populate without giving that very concept an inkling of brainpower.

Of course I also believe that we as a species take more time to choose a car or a microwave oven than the thought we give to choosing a partner for life. Again these are my thoughts....

Here is a web site I found a while back, it peaks my interest about the possibility of over unity...
http://www.lutec.com.au/

Again these people are being ridiculed for their efforts. I say lets get it out there and see if this works or not...

This is enough for now sorry for being so long this time....

Ely

Palooka's Revenge said...

Territorial Seed Company (Google it)

the author of the gardening book i'm currently reading founded this company in your state fa. his name is steve solomon and the book is "gardening when it counts... growing food in hard times" and now lives in australia.

the emphasis is on low input methods... low labor, hand tools, little or no electricity or irrigation using ancestoral techniques and applicable to most english-speaking areas except the tropics and deserts. you need sun and space though... a couple thousand sq ft (20 x 100) not counting orchids and berries to grow a garden for 4.

lotsa damn good tips even if you're limited and have to resort to other approaches like containers or raised beds. especially plant chemistry but in laymen's terms. great stuff for the beginner and seasoned as well. recommend highly.... p

murph said...

Ely,

I have no problem with the length of your comments. Cripes, if you would like to write a post, send it to me.

I just don't know about Williams. I reckon somewhere down the road it may become clear.

I still think more cheap energy will drive us extinct through depletion of everything else. It is cheap energy that allows us to manipulate and deplete the biosphere. If we could go to other planets to live, then this would not have such a drastic impact. I'm sure you have seen the calculations that to have world wide the living standard of the advanced western countries would take 3 earths.

When we look a the record of past civilizations,every time they found new energy sources, population did an overshoot growth, demanding more resources and energy. I saw a documentary last night that said that in 1800, world population was at 1 billion and had been so for quite some time right around that number give or take some. By 1950 it was 2.5 billion. Now it is around 6.7 billion. I have seen figures that say that it is possible to feed that many and other figures that say it is impossible to do so. In any case, most of the worlds population is on subsistence to starvation rations.
So, if we continue to have abundant inexpensive energy available, I think it is safe to say that populations will increase. Even China with their 1 child per pair can't keep the growth down. Historically, there is reason to say that most empires and past civilizations had the same problem, population overshoot in relation to energy and food sources. Can you imagine the type of control it would take or the mental change it would take to stop that process?

In any case, it sure appears to me that the abundance of cheap fossil energy sources are the root cause of the extreme environmental destruction we can observe any time we take a serious look.

The mental position that says 'so what' fails to see that humans are dependent on the environmental health of the planet for their existence and the relationships of all living organisms to each other. Now personally, from my perspective, I lay a great deal of blame for this attitude at the feet of religions, and most especially Christianity as it has been misused. The doctrine of Manifest Destiny has nearly ruined this continent and was responsible for a 100 years and more of genocide. Same can be said of most parts of the world with differing religions taking part. In the case of Christianity, they were charged by the words in their holy book with stewardship of the planet, for which they have for the most part ignored over the centuries. It is easy to talk the talk, but walking the walk is a whole other thing. Combine that with abundant cheap energy has proven to be disastrous. Don't mistake my intentions here, for religion has been only part of the problem, even if we can point to its lions share.

So unless we can find a way to dramatically increase fertile land, find new sources of water, and do so without the degradation of mono culture farming, we are going to have a lot of folks starving. The latest projections I have seen indicate that the planet will support sustainably only a maximum of 1 billion.

What ya think?

murph said...

kepmefre,

Well well, didn't know we had someone following this blog from our neck of the woods.

Like us, gardening is a tough business in this climate, although your location is better then ours. We are generally 5 degrees or so colder, a genuine micro climate. 10 miles south it is even colder, higher in altitude.

LOL You want crazy, come visit us. I presume you are aware of this areas fight with the county government.

Anonymous said...

Murph....OK you gave me the green light on length of comment...lol

I find your way of thinking refreshing... cannot say I agree a 100% on everything but behind every comment it seems to me that there is a significant amount of thought gone into it, and from where I sit a whole lot more people need to do it that way. Perhaps one day I will take time to put to words some of the thoughts that cross into my mind and put it out there for everyone at this fire to comment on, for me that would help to validate ideas that sometimes have me turning in bed at night. Perhaps one day I will get around to it, trouble is that when I am most creative in thought I am also the busiest with my hands and typing is low on this list of things to get done.... but who knows one day it may all come together.

Now... I am with you on this fellow Williams. Not sure what I should think of him, that little voice inside tells me that he is pure snake oil salesman yet he says things that I have to agree with. I guess the loudest message is that WE as a species are in fact controlled by a very few, we are in fact no more than livestock to the upper echelon to be done with as we do to our livestock... Still if he is/was privy to information that would have been to the betterment to all around him could he have not found a way to get it out there before this time? Perhaps there was a select group of his followers that DID benefit from his inside knowledge and if so then what does that really make him out to be. Perhaps I am being naive or cynical... Maybe just maybe he is the finest person one could associate with, but for now I think I will listen to that little voice inside cause thus far in my life it has a pretty good track record separating the wheat from the chaff.

Regarding population growth, I am going to sound a bit downright cruel and un sympathetic but here goes.... I think this rock we all share of whom I lovingly refer to as our mother earth will in time take care of this problem and make no doubts about it, population explosion is a BIG problem in some parts of the planet.

We will be like the rabbit population who over periods of time, correct me if I am wrong but I think is a 7 year cycle, get into a population explosion such that natural predators cannot contain the rapid growth. It is at this point in time a disease affects the population such that only the strongest will survive and natural balance is once again restored until such a point in time the population of the rabbits again require this natural culling.

The world population will go through this as well. It will be tragic, it will be devastating, and a lot of social groups will cry long an far about how the world has to do something. I ask do what?? So the parts of the world that have in most cases just enough of what they need are to give to those parts that do not, and yet there is no checks or balances to make sure that what is supplied is used in a manner that is efficient and effective in sustaining their system and development. In the event that we do provide enough what is in place to keep the problem of rapid birth rate from continuing to spiral out of control. Many of these places also adhere to a strict religious doctrine concerning birth control.

It is painfully obvious we have not the ability to control this manifestation, maybe we need to let nature take its toll.

These populations continue to grow at an exponential rate and even more so now because now that the natural process of starvation culling is no longer in effect, this because now the rest of the world is taking care of them even when they themselves could not comprehend that part of their unconscionable problem was rapid population growth and they failed to deal with it.

I can be sympathetic when unexpected devastation occurs from events not within the control of certain peoples, be they earthquakes, Tsunamis, volcanic eruptions and yes even drought but.... if these become a natural cyclic event and you still wish to endure these events in an ongoing basis I cannot support you and your disabled thought. Even less if you stay under these conditions and continue to populate in wild abandon.

I can hear it now... what a hard and uncaring bastard but WTF it IS how I think now, never used to be this way but almost a half century of believing that people can and do the intelligent thing most of time has been proven wrong by having me get out here in the real world. Let the earth mother deal the cards play the winning hand and then we can start again.... Can I get a Yes Darwin?

About abundant and cheap energy, yes it is possible that in some parts of the world it leads to over population I would have to ponder that a bit more. Then I get to thinking about how in my own part of the world the actual birth rate is dropping to a point that the government is wondering who is going to take care of the aged population down the road. I believe the birth rate is someplace around 2.5 children per family, of course that was about 10 years ago so I am thinking it has dropped further. I think if it has not then it is to the credit of immigrant families who still believe that bigger families are better.

I think about the stats that say we live longer and yes that is do to the direct influence of an abundant energy and a society providing better medicines better medical equipment so it leads to agreeing with your comment. Then I start to think that abundant cheap energy or not people in some parts of the world have this propensity to procreate regardless of their particular means.I think of images of places in India, in Pakistan, Somalia, Ethiopia where they still cook and heat their humble abodes with cow dung yet there is a gaggle of children in the little hut. Cheap and abundant energy perhaps speeds up this process of birthing like rabbits but I think it is only a part of the over all picture concerning over population, and now I think I am just babbling....

Ahhhh Religion.... If there is one area brother Murph that I am on the page with you it would be this one. Now I do not have a problem with people getting together to feel good about a certain social belief but when that belief becomes we are the chosen ones for this that or the other reason and so should you choose not believe we will convert you...if we fail at that we will eliminate you, can we see a particular country that fits this picture? There in lies my problem with religion.

I believe in a creator, perhaps one of my many failings, but I do, I do not believe in calling him God, Krishna, Jehovah, Buddha, or any of the other myriad of names bestowed upon this force. For me this is the creator, this force resides in all of us. The practice of religion is now and perhaps has always been just an organized business for nothing more than the benefit again of a select few at the very expense of the many. When people are negated from independent thought, this is something the organized religions of all stripes are very good at, we as a society have a real problem and the church, et al Religion and the PTB have been very good at keeping people from having any kind of individual thought because guess what? that leads to questioning the PTB.


OK this is enough for now.... you have me touching on topics of thought that can get me stirred. For now give this a chew, I would like to hear once again your comments.

Ely

freeacre said...

Ely,
I, too, vacillate over the population situation, and tend to take a rather hard line. Some days, I think that receiving larger checks with each child that a woman gives birth to that she cannot afford is rewarding the wrong behavior. Better to give out a set rate of money, and if she has to share that amount with 1 or ten will be her call.If they all begin to starve, she should be judged unfit to parent, and the children should be removed from her care. Sorry. One thinks that she will limit the births herself that way. I would also offer free sterilization and birth control, and maybe educational incentives for having 1 or no children.
The other thing that I think about regularly is how to make a graceful exit from this incarnation before the stage of becoming a "useless eater," as that miscreant, Henry Kissinger, so harshly called them. I dearly miss my own mother, who died at 82. I wish she were still here. But, for myself, I am trying to come to grips with how much is enough? Do I pick an arbitrary age, like 70? Do I just refuse to take any medications that keep me artificially alive (like blood pressure meds) and allow nature to provide the correct allotment of time for this one? Right now it seems as though the medical and pharmaceutical corporations are just milking vast amounts of money from the 70+ crowd for medicine and medical procedures. That seems to be their main function, in addition to keeping the doors of Dunkin' Donuts, Denny's and IHOP open. Now that may be a totally harsh and stereotypical view. After all, Murph is approaching that age, and he is very viable, so it may be very wrong to set a certain age.
Maybe it's better to decide when you have added as much as you have to give to the planet and it would be just existing or serving the medical establishment that would be left. Time to go so that the resources can be distributed to those who still have their lives in front of them.
I don't know. On other days, I, like you, remember that our Mother, the Earth, has ways of dealing with the problem. Why kill yourself, when the asteroid, or plague is going to wipe out almost all life on the planet anyway?
This is one issue that I believe we will all need to consider for ourselves. Our own life is the only one that we have a right to decide upon, in my view. I do think that is would be an act of grace to leave a little on the plate for someone else, rather than to fight and claw for every additional crumb or day.

murph said...

Ely,

I think that for the most part we are on the same page. We may differ to some extent on the details, but then again, what was that thing about the devil is in the details? lol

Population discussions are a real bugaboo. Nobody wants to deal with it really, and politically it is a guaranteed method of not being elected to dog catcher or anything else for that matter. You qualify some of your comments on this by talking about regional overpopulation. I tend to think in global terms about it. But even in the countries that have lowered birth rates, notice how people live. Squeezed up in cities. Now it would be interesting to talk about whether that is either natural way of living or if it is even a healthy thing to do. Interestingly, when indigenous people are pulled out of their environment and put into cities, they seldom do well at it. Is that data significant? The other point I would make is that cities can only exist by exploiting the areas around them and even other countries. Without that exploitation they could not exist. That is, they are unsustainable without conquest and exploitation. Cities are where the majority of humans live. Another interesting piece, about 2 billion of the 6.5 billion on this earth don't live in cities. So what is to become of these hives of human population when the resources dry up? They no longer can migrate to another place and start providing for themselves like has been done in the past. There isn't enough unsettled and undeveloped land left on earth. If we agree that resources are declining and becoming more expensive to obtain and less plentiful then about 4.5 to 5 billion people are going to take the long dark ride.

We went to a get together tonight and got into a discussion with a real honest to god neocon. The whole discussion was carried out in the manner of Rush Limbaugh or Hannity style. Same arguments, same style of presentation, what they cannot deal with in logic they bombast you with words and irrelevancies. The same style applies to population problems only they most of the time come from the left of the political spectrum.

I suspect that you are right that the problem will be taken care of by nature itself, although mankind seems to be doing it's damnedest to get rid of as many as possible, and especially if they have darker colored skins.

I got to admit that it has been a very long time ago that I believed that leaders and people would rationally do the right thing. I keep asking myself if this lends weight to the idea that we are a fallen race. sigh.

When I look at history, it sure appears to me that the misuse of religion in some form is what is mostly responsible for the wars and genocide, despite what their holy books say. Had an interesting exchange a while ago with a fundy. In exasperation I told him that he can believe what he wants, but if he starts another war over whose ancient book is the authority I was going to be a very dangerous enemy of his. Totalitarianism by politics or religion is not a good thing to present to me as a means of social control. I do get a bit testy about it.

So write up a post. Get a name for yourself at the campfire. Besides, writing stuff down and putting it into understandable form is a good exercise to clarify ones thinking. I think the day is past when convincing others was viable. We mostly preach to a choir and talk about stuff, except of course when the cricket speaks to us. Then is when the new stuff comes blasting across our stern

freeacre said...

To say, "Happy Memorial Day" seems to be a contradiction in terms. Memorial Day is not a happy one, unless you devote it to having a BBQ or spend it in some other sort of Wally-world exercise. Memorial Day should be centered around a sense of honor and gratitude to those who step up and become a part of the military to uphold those principals that most of us pay only lip service to... and in the process have suffered and died. One would hope that those of the ruling class who regularly disparage those welfare and food stamp receiving single mothers, for instance, would come to a minute of two realization that those food stamps are feeding the children who regularly enter the military and put their lives on the line for the rich SOB who profits from his wars.
We all should take some time to examine our own complicity in creating the conditions that put our soldiers in danger - the over consumption of resources, and the turning away from the responsibility to enhance peace rather than provoke war.
I, for one, woke up grateful to Stoney, an ex Navy SEAL, and other veterans at this council who use their strength to protect us and this nation and its ideals.

Anonymous said...

Sorry for not posting sooner, had obligations but I wanted to respond...

FA,

I know what you mean regarding the hard line concerning a persons choices, and are we as a society rewarding the actions contrary to a properly thinking society.

A small story here... I had a friend a long ways back. She was an exceptional student all through high school, her garnering anything less than a “B” in a specific class was not common. She went on to college is all we really knew of her as after high school maintaining track of past school mates became difficult but as things go I did eventually run into her quite by accident. She did in fact go to college but I surmise that the freedom of being out from under the control or rather direction of her parents was too tempting and the party and social life that can be found on most campuses she succumbed to. To make a long story short she hooked up with a guy and proceeded to have a child with him. He left and well her aspiration of finishing college gone with him. Still instead of validating her position and realizing that now she needed to work even harder to maintain not just one but two people she went on welfare or as some call it social assistance.

They doled out to her pretty much everything she required to exist but what I found to be the real tragedy was that she basically became a baby making factory to supplement her income. Simply put if she wanted a bigger apartment she found another sperm donor and had another kid. At the time I ran into her she was working on number three. It pretty much explained everything at that point and well I never had contact with her again. I just found it sad and at the same time a real slap in the face of all those who work hard to support that sort of life choice....

Now regarding when time is up....this is something I have given considerable thought to. I agree that the medical community does tend to make the infirm a sort of cash machine with the graces of the big pharma and don't forget that the politicians are also up to their collective elbows in it. I have told my wife that I would hope if and when the time comes and I can no longer have what I deem and acceptable quality of life, we have discussed what that in fact means to me, I want help to cross over. End of story.

When I have to knowingly or unknowingly put someone through the distaste of having to change my soiled and putrid linens, feed me mulched food, make small talk to me to keep me company I am sorry but as a baby we have a life to look forward to and that is part and parcel with having children but.... when you get to that point in your life when you are as defenseless as a new born but have somewhere locked up inside the knowledge of how degrading the scenario is for not only you but those who are charged with your personal up keep, and pray to get those who actually give a shit cause often the task is farmed out for hire and not to your family, then the time is up.

I think about this and I wonder what I should be doing and that is when my solitude hits. Would I like help at this point??? I am not sure that would be fair because in our society euthanasia is a crime thus making those involved criminals. Not so much for helping to end the suffering, although they claim it is nothing more than a murder, but for tampering with the potential profits of all the groups above so mentioned.
No..... I am thinking I should investigate a little deeper the possibility of constructing an amulet that I can carry with me at all times much like the first alert bracelets and neck chains. Inside that amulet I would have some sort of substance that in effect would speed my demise in a painless way. All that I would be required to do is to crush it with my teeth should I still have some.

I am one of those who is completely baffled by this species, call us human, who if the same affect were to befall the family dog or the family cat who in most cases are in fact a members of the family to most, the honorable thing, the humane thing to do, the family often does, and is to help end the suffering. BUT Hey no way with humans... the doctors and Big pharma use us as lab experiments because there is always a new and better formula they can try... the politicians maintain the laws requiring the family to maintain electrical impulses in that carcass cause it is by their definition, that an actual life one would be taken...HELLLLOOOOOO if there is no chance for complete recovery and a return to a decent standard of life what kind of life form is that?? That my friends is an experiment plain and simple just as it was for me when I was in High School attempting to see how long I could keep rat tissue responding to electrical stimuli in my poor sample dead rat. I guess that is what we have become to those who should know better....lab rats.

So yes FA, it is our life and at the very least we should have a say in how we exit. I am reminded of the scene in the movie Dances With Wolves where the tribe is packing to leave to winter camp, however there is an elderly couple knowing full well they cannot make the trek decide on staying and the tribe is in acceptance of this. They made the choice to remain for an inevitable end and in doing so they chose for them what they deemed a noble exit strategy....

Murph

You make a very valid point concerning cities. Let me quantify what I am thinking here by simply saying that by the definition of city I will mean populations that are in excess of lets say a million persons. What a wonderful way to population control for the PTB if they should decide that the large cities be the target for population adjustment? I can think of a lot of ways that a population within a city could be decimated should that be a requirement and most of those ways would be to little to late for the inhabitants should they make it so.

You are correct large population centers do in fact put a HUGE strain on the environment around them. There is virtually no potential to live in balance within that particular environment when the population gets to large. Not a chance in hell despite all the collective efforts of the do gooders trying to to go green within the huge urban collective. It is like a colony of rats... they start to fight with with each other try to kill each other off when the population is unsupportable by the area they are trying to colonize.....

I believe there is a correction coming. Will I be here to see it that is a question I have no answer for. I do know that at our present pace of destruction of the environment, in essence the destruction of ourselves, that correction probably will not be that long in the future.

Religion... that is always an interesting topic. I know my wife shakes her head when I go on about religions failings according to me..she is catholic, but in the end all that I point to she can only agree that I am not fabricating that what I see is factual. Religion is in my mind but one more method for those in the upper echelons to control the masses period, end of story.

I will give it some thought, the idea of putting something down for the blog. As you can see when I get started I tend to get a bit long in the pen...LOL, trouble is when I am doing this there are things that put food on the table that are taking a back seat and well that is not fare to the efforts of my wife.

Take care for now

Ely

freeacre said...

Ely,
You are writing from Brazil, aren't you? I sure would like to know what things look like from there and what issues are of concern in Brazil. I have almost no idea. It would make a great post, I am certain.

Anonymous said...

Hola FA

I am close to Brazil, I am actually residing in Colombia, and if you would like to know what this part of the world is like according to what I see I can give you that impression as well...

Ely

Anonymous said...

Have you all seen this one?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WGZ-HxIzsWA

-rockpicker

Anonymous said...

Wow This subject has come a long way, from oil to holidays to singing the follies of America.

Not unlike a really good campfire chat.

Leaves me with the gut feeling that the Hindu scriptures are right about Maya. I just wonder how hard you would have to slap humanity to get it to wake up.

Let us all pray not prey.

The number of people that are beginning to question our actions is a GOOD sign. Now it seems that we need to look for ways to lead the other 99.9% this way.

I am told that example is the best way.

Perhaps it is late enough to toss a log on the fire and tell a few ghost stories.

In the dark of night a shadow appeared. It circled the campfire three times. Then it faded back into the shadows. An eerie voice was heard. "Vanity, vanity, is this all there is to life?"

All were quiet. Tears were shed and the fire turned a beautiful violet color. It seemed to beckon all to stand in its flame and be cleansed.

LC

freeacre said...

Nice to hear from you, LC. My mind has been turning to something similar, I think. There is so much contradictory information. Opposing arguments for and against peak oil, the differing political candidates, bear markets vs. bull market scenarios, collapse, transformation, extra-terrestrials, false flag events, and on and on. Seems to be no limit to the ways the mind can conger up differing scenarios. It's so seductive, and ultimately depressing. The "10,000 things" that the Buddha refers to that distract one from knowing the truth of who we really are.
At this point, I am ready to fall silent and listen to the song of the crickets, glad to be with my clan at the fire.
And, yes, Ely, from Columbia or wherever you are, that would be good.

Anonymous said...

Benjamin Fulford has reappeared in a video offered by rense.com today in which he accuses evil American "bullies" of using H.A.A.R.P to create the China quake, the Myanmar cyclone and the Indonesian tsunami.

Elsewhere, a collection of retired, high-ranking and decorated military men and women say the official government story about 9/11 is baloney and "impossible," and they're calling for a new and independent investigation. Can't happen soon enough.

LC,
I like your story. Let's have some more.

-rockpicker

Anonymous said...

More for RP

As the flames did dance
Their eyes did close.
There within a vision rose

Infinite being was theirs to have
Infinite joy was what they felt
Infinite knowledge filled their soul

It is yours to have a voice did sing
If only you could see within

A campfire is a mystery spot
One side warm the other not

Grab yourself a violet rose
Think about these silly prose

LC

Palooka's Revenge said...

rp.... check this out..... BlackLight announces 50,000 watt prototype. 5/28 press release...
http://www.blacklightpower.com/Press%20Releases/BlackLightPressReleaseProcessInfo052808Sb.pdf

"BlackLight Power Inc. is the inventor of a paradigm-shifting new primary energy source and a new field of hydrogen chemistry with broad commercial applications. Its wholly-owned subsidiary, Millsian Inc. is dedicated to developing computational chemical design technology based on The Grand Unified Theory of Classical Physics (GUT-CP), a revolutionary approach to solving atomic and molecular structures. The Millsian Software Version 1.0 is now available."

blp has been around for awhile and working on this new tech which is being released to the pub domain for review. extensive papers on the web site... "the blacklight process generates enormous amounts of cheap, non-polluting heat that will replace the thermal power in coal, oil, gas, and nuclear power plants that is then converted to electricity.... the hydrogen burning car has been possible for decades, but there has never been a way to produce cheap hydrogen until today. we are projecting that we will be at the scale of power generation necesary for a power plant to replace the gasoline pumped in a day at a station with hydrogen from water in approximately 24 months."

murph... this will piss you off as it begs the obvious... ya, but what about the pop prob???? i would have to agree. the pop prob is a reflection of, among other things, the energy prob and the energy prob is a reflection of core issues within the human condition that need to evolve. ignore this and any form of "savior science" is merely form change.

lc... were it only that easy. but a comforting thought no doubt... p

Anonymous said...

P
We better pray that it is that simple.
If BLP was a proven fact they would have INSLAWed it by now.
If the American public can stand for the blatant 911 joke on them and not miss a trip to the mall we are in deep dodo.
We have been lied to for decades to further the PTB cause and nobody cares.
If we don't take the steps necessary to wakeup we ARE doomed.
Our National bird has morph into an Ostridge checking for hemorrhoids.
Pray that we all learn to look at the madness that is our insane EGO.

LC

Anonymous said...

P,

Thanks for the heads -up on the Blacklight announcement. We can only watch and see what comes of it. Sounds great, if it's true. And if the principals live to carry their plans to fruition.

LC,

You may have hit the nail on the head by calling attention to man's 'vanity' and 'ego.'

Freeacre,

That volcanic ash can be an asset. I've been searching for some, myself. Chemically, it has many of the same trace minerals as granite dust. It should be high in potassium.

I have a friend who makes compost from wood shavings I provide him for bedding his wife's horses. He turns it with a skid-steer loader, and makes 10 yds. at a time. We're looking for other things to add to the mix, and volcanic ash is one of those useful, organic ingredients.

For nitrogen, I fill an old pillow case with chiken shit and dunk it in a large barrel of water. I use a number ten can to dilute this aromatic concentrate. Ratio is one # 10 can to five gallons clean water. As the concentrate gets low, just replenish with the hose.
A five-ga. bucket of chicken manure
gets me through the entire summer in this fashion.

It's still unseasonably cool here. Plums and cherries are flowering. Apples are just coming on now, though mine have almost no blossoms. I'll miss making cider from them in Sept.

Oh, and an old cement mixer works great for designing one's own soil composition.

-rockpicker

Anonymous said...

You folks are great. You have managed to get me thinking an some new directions. We the people of the USA are pretty ignorant when it comes to the way we think. Most of us are only living for the moment and don't take in to consideration how the rest of the world has to live. I think that in along run that possibly the people in the third world countries are going to be better of than most of the people in the USA. They are used to living closer to the land and having nothing. We might just starve to death. Population control?? I always thought of it as a non issue. I just spent 3 and a half days out in the desert here, thinking that I would just get away from everyone. Hell, I still had neighbors. When you can drive 75 or 80 miles from the nearest populated area and still run into people and there is nothing to draw them out there, maybe we do need some population control.
kepmefre

murph said...

kepmefre

I rather imagine nature will take care of population overshoot if our owners don't.