Saturday, February 11, 2012


WHAT FAILING GOVERNMENT AND INFRASTRUCTURE LOOK LIKE. Old house in Detroit that was once an elite abode.

from murph

I’m impressed, I really am. In the last post, it feels like the amount of information that the readers of this blog are posting indicate they are taking an appreciable amount of time digging around seeing what they can come up with to clarify the general condition and explain some of the events they read about and the statements by the elites. It appears to me that there has been an upsurge in independent research on a variety of fronts. The veiled research by the mega corporations is being challenged, independents are coming up with very different data on just about everything.

I read just about every day, 5 different sites by people dealing mostly with the economic situation from several perspectives. I also get into around 6 other sites that deal with general commentaries on the social situation and then there are the sites that deal with what to do with the perception that our situation is going to hell. All in all, it generally takes at least 3 hrs a day to get through all of this. If I am feeling particularly masochistic I will spend more time at some of the more fringe sites, looking at “far removed from the contemporary” kind of information.

Often I will spend an hour or 2 following up on the links you readers provide and making comments about them. So, rest assured that either or both of us get around to going to your links in the comments sooner or later.

The consequence is that I often feel an information overload. Just too much to deal with. Part of that may have something to do with aging and/or chemtrails or god knows what.

One of the consequences that I figure many people have with so much information is what we call cognitive dissonance, the mental confusion from so much contradictory information. How one deals with this is important. One method is to just flat ignore or actively reject everything that contradicts your perceptions. Those that take the time to try and sort out these contradictions then have to deal with big time cognitive switches. This can cause a lot of personal problems, particularly if the switch involves life style changes that generally make folks very uncomfortable. I figure that we are going to be seeing a lot of interesting behavior changes in folks due to these perception changes. As the social changes become more harsh, I anticipate a rise in antisocial behavior; thievery, violence, outbursts of anger, physical assaults, social activism and demonstrations, etc. We already seem to be experiencing a bit of an increase in these behaviors in our little community. Not real serious yet, but what seems to me to be an observable increase. What about your area?

If this behavior begins to have serious increases, we are also going to experience an ever tightening of bureaucratic authoritarian control. The occupy movement has already experienced it. Syria, Egypt and Greece are experiencing it. The PTB and their enforcement cannot, of course, allow that to escalate. So their repression will correspondingly also increase. I lay all of these problems on two principle sources; money in the guise of the banksters, and the decline of energy and other non renewable resources. Until our allocation of resources drastically changes and our kowtowing to those in charge of the medium of exchange ends, it will only become worse.

On the energy side, some drastic changes seem to be showing up. The whole issue of cold fusion for the generation of electricity seems to have been swept up into a demonstrably usable form, at least in Europe. Of course, if this indeed proves to be scalable and inexpensive enough, it would revolutionize that energy source. Supposedly, from what I have read, home units are indeed in service, are affordable (as opposed to solar power) and dependable with very low maintenance costs. Supposedly, home units are supposed to hit the market this year. We shall see. If the folks trying to get this going are killed, all bets are off on this.

The whole issue of the banking PTB in charge of the world wide economic situation could possibly be resolved by a massive worldwide depression. Cliff High and a substantial amount of the economic community say that they expect it in March-June. Of course if a world war breaks out over the contentions in the east, all bets are off on this one. I suspect that war will break out for just that reason, keeping the moneyed PTB in charge.

Randy put up a link to a 1920’s anarchist and scientist that I found refreshing. Peter Kropotkin wrote extensively on how humans can organize themselves in a non-hierarchical system, which we call anarchy. I have written about this for some time. I fear that most folks could not stomach this at all. We are too used to having a very small minority of folks that are authorized (voluntarily or not) to tell us what is good for us and how to live. It would demand that people accept responsibility for their decisions, which sure seems to me to not be a popular position at all. Instead we have allowed (or in some cases demanded) complex control systems to take over our lives with a very few folks doing the decision making. In my case, I like to dream of a most radical change in how folks deal with their lives that would be more along the lines of a ideal anarchistic way of living. I don’t expect I will live long enough to see it and maybe humans for the most part are not able to live that way.

The worlds situation, economically, socially and government wise seems to be escalating in a downward trend. Freeacre and I are trying to prepare for it anticipating it to continue to do so. It is possible that it will cease, but looks like a very low probability to me. I do expect an escalation in harsh government suppression, worldwide. I do anticipate shortages of those items needed to sustain life, namely; food, housing, water, heat (in the more northern climates, most of the US) and other resources. If we have some kind of nuclear exchange, we will then have to contend with more radiation exposure. Climate change weather will also be a factor for more natural disasters and hardship. Polluted and poisoned environment will cause more misery. I see some very hard times a-coming.


Hotspringswizard said...

I agree with your various obsevations Murph. However, regarding fusion, I have not heard or seen any reports of any viable fusion for domestic or commercial use because of the many ongoing problems with the attempted development of this technology. I believe it was Tom Murphy who had done a recent list of articles at the and in his " fusion " segment and he suggested the same. I'd like to see the info on this " viable " fusion you say is being used right now. One thing to consider too, fusion if made viable at some point would be producing electricity, and the world is headed for a massive liquid hydrocarbon fuels scarcity problem.

I see last week the approval given for the flying of thousands of new drones in the US. Combined with the NDAA and all of the other draconian new legislation looks like the PTB are getting ready for the inevitable increasing unrest in the US.

But on the bright side, there are five new super Walmarts going up this year in our Victor Valley high desert area. Of course with " progress " like that, everything is going to be OK, no worries :-)

murph said...


I thought I had bookmarked two sites that talked about what is going on in Europe over cold fusion. I can't find them again. sigh. They were sent to me by a friend interested in this area.

From what I remember, I think it was in Jan, the Swiss demonstration seemingly convinced some invited scientists that the device indeed worked. Supposedly the French have ordered some units. One article stated that home sized units were going into production this year. Of course seeing will be believing in my opinion. I don't think it would be wise to hold your breath over it though. If it actually works and can be produced it will change the energy game considerably.

This web site has a bit of info on Rossi and cold fusion

I have no idea if this is more hype or not. Interesting though

Anonymous said...


Haven't read the post yet I just wanted to to give these links as an addendum to the previous post


Mutual Aid by Petr Kropotkin can be found here

An audio version can be found here for those who want to wander round whilst you hear it but the reader appears to be Indian or some such and the sentence phrasing is all wrong. You can decide whether you take it or leave it. I left it and am busy with the text version at the moment.

Thanks for the heads up Randy.

Anonymous said...


Well I guess that last comment just goes to show you. I am not sure what it shows you but something anyway.

Yes, age, chemtrails and me always having been a slow reader, which is a condition that pisses me off but when I deliberately try to cram I get a muggy head. There is nothing I can do against it, it is just the way it is.

How long do you reckon before the good burgers (citizens) start to form vigilante groups, firstly against the yobs you mention and then secondly against the police? The Arab Spring is all about taking away the administrations moral authority to govern. When will the great American public catch on? I read somewhere recently, maybe it was here, “War is when somebody else tells you who the bad guy is, revolution is when you decide it for yourself.”

It really does amaze me the support the candidates in the current Republican circus are getting. Although I have seen one or two thoughtful types interviewed who say “We are here to listen to what they have to say for themselves”. This in itself seems to be a small turning in attitude.

Regular items at the end of the TV news over the last week has been whether a ship canal in the north of Belgium will freeze to 12 centimetres in order to allow people to ice skate from Belgium into Holland, which is a fun thing to do apparently. About 50 yards behind my apartment there is a large stream / small river and I have been considering spending (fairly) serious money on a water pump/filter, the sort mountaineers use that filters down to 0.2 microns. It is supposed to remove pathogens and has a secondary carbon filter to remove any bad tastes. Last night temperatures got down to about 14°F and this morning the thing was flowing as fast as ever. What does that tell you about what is in the water? Mind you it doesn't seem to do the ducks any harm.

rockpicker said...

Haven't heard anyone mention the work Mr2Tuff2 has been doing, but if you haven't seen his videos on dissociating water into hydrogen and oxygen, using electricity produced by home-made solar panels, (he shows how he built everything himself, step by step,) it's well worth the time spent.

He says a gallon of water has 30 times as much energy in it than a gallon of gasoline.

He does fun stuff like explode balloons of O and H mixed, which he says makes water, and releases fireballs of energy in the process. He is also filming these explosions and close examination of the pics indicates that something odd electrically happens just before the balloon explodes. A blue flash the eye can't see preceeds the fireball, accompanied by what appears to be tiny lightning streaks. He calls this
violent reassociation of elements a form of cold fusion.

rockpicker said...

This just in, from John Kettler:

wv= coups (for real!)

rockpicker said...

Reports on Twitter yesterday were debunked by U.S. officials, who claim reports of Kim Jong Un's assassination were unbased.

Anybody got more on this?

Anonymous said...


You know the saying about never believe a rumour until it has been officially denied, however this Kim Jong Un one seems definitely unsubstantiated. I guess we will know if he makes another public appearance.

On the science: If you put electrical energy into water, that energy will chemically dissociate the water into oxygen molecules and hydrogen molecules. 2H2O → 2H2 + O2 It is possible for the oxygen and hydrogen in stoichiometric proportions to recombine to reform water.
2H2 + O2 → 2H2O + energy This condensation energy is equivalent to the amount of electrical energy that had to be put in to do the dissociation in the first place. Oxygen and hydrogen mixtures are stable under normal conditions but require in initial input of energy to form an unstable intermediate H4O2 which only exists for a nano second before it dissociates into oxygen and hydrogen. Because of its make up, oxygen can accept two electrons into its outer shell of electrons. Hydrogen can donate one electron each. This is an arrangement which suits both oxygen and hydrogen atoms since water is at a lower energy state than the gaseous molecules. These are combination, dissociation CHEMICAL reactions since they are only concerned with changes in the arrangement of the outer electrons. The word fusion is specifically reserved for combination changes which occur in the nucleus. On an arbitrary scale of carbon has an atomic weight of 12 then a hydrogen atom has a weight of 1.008. The fusion reaction of the hydrogen bomb (and the sun for that matter) is 4H → helium (He with a weight of 4) with the destruction of 0.032 units if mass which is transformed into energy. In practice hydrogen is too reactive to exist just a H so in the above reaction it is done with one atom of deuterium (H+neutron) and one atom of tritium (H+2neutrons). The reaction is
(H+neutron) + (H+2neutrons) → (He (=2H+2neutrons) + 3.5MeV) + (neutron + 14.1MeV)

I sure hope I didn't loose you in this. Long story short is that dissociation / condensation of water is Chemistry. Fusion is nuclear physics. I hope I didn't come over too school mastery in this :-)

freeacre said...

I have been haunting the rumor mill, Godlike Productions, again. It seems I have been a"unbanned." Anyway, it seems the young mutant still lives. But, then, it took several days before they let on about his dad's death.

What's this John Kettler site about" ET Ninja's? Have they finally arrived? Dang! Just when I think things can't get any weirder....

Also, it looks as if the caucus results from Maine and maybe Missouri and several states have been manipulated so that many of the Ron Paul votes were not counted. Remember last time? The Republicans wouldn't even allow him into the Convention. I think he should run as an Independent. Love to seem him partner with Dennis Kucinich, but that's just me.

murph said...


I'm entirely unsure just what the point Mr2tuf generation of water separation is supposed to show.

His claim of 30 times the energy contained in water as compared to gasoline is a non sequitor IMO. What seems more significant to me is how much energy it takes to make hydrogen and to make it useful, that is, generating heat to do mechanical work. This simple question is the reason why I think that the use of hydrogen to convert to useful work cannot be viable. At least until we find a virtually free source of hydrogen that is easily trapped, and I don't know of any such sources.

IMO it all comes down to total energy input to total net energy output ratios. At the present, it appears that that this ratio in regards to petroleum is rapidly decreasing, that is, the total energy in to extract a net energy return is trending to a break even point. When that point is reached, then extracting oil will cease.

All of the green energy sources are experiencing the same problem. Ethanol is a prime example and notice that the push for ethanol has almost ceased, Brazil not withstanding.

And, none of these sources add in the environmental impacts either and the long range consequences. It seems to me that we really need to be more concerned with reducing energy usage rather than trying to keep it the same or even increasing its usage. But, that of course will necessitate a change in lifestyle and to this point, is mostly unacceptable to most folks unless it is someone else that has to do the changing.

rockpicker said...


You need to go back into Mr2's video archives a ways to see what he's been doing, as he is a backyard tinkerer and he's been documenting his work. It's fascinating.
As stated in my previous comment, he's dissociating water with solar energy generated from his own site-built panels, so once the panels are up and running, the input energy is basically free, isn't it? Yet, the energy output from the solar array is producing a highly efficient, storable energy product, hydrogen gas.
For demonstration purposes, he's constructed a hand-held gas burner made of a copper tubing, a mig welding tip, and a gate valve. He slides a balloon filled with hydrogen/oxygen mix on one end and lights the other end, which burns like an acetylline torch til the gas burns up.


Thanks for the technical details, though, yes, you did lose me along the way. However, this I do recall, now that you mention it. Pons and Fleischmann, who first reported the cold fusion experiments done in Utah twenty years ago, were chemists. Their work was challenged and 'debunked' by nuclear physicists not trained in chemistry, and, as I understand, failed to faithfully replicate the original experiment.

rockpicker said...

Speaking of information, check out the latest in robotics.

rockpicker said...

And here's another recap explaining the current situation, and urging immediate action.

Hotspringswizard said...

Regarding creating oxygen and hydrogen from water, or cold fusion, I doubt either process will see large scale usage in our situation of a growing hydrocarbon fuel depletion scenario.

To use the hydrogen, you would be up against all of the many technological problems associated with any use of this energy, which would include having a massive infrastructure system set up for its use. Like Murph mentioned above the EROEI is not worth it for many of the " promising " new energy schemes, and mostly the rosy assesments of their use does not consider the hydrocarbon fuels declines which would make the creation of vast new energy scheme infrastructure unachievable.

More simply considered, if you don't see a new energy technology proliferating in availability on a large scale, or its mass use for the common people, it really does not matter if it is " truly " viable, no matter the real reasons for it not being used. When and if either of these energy ideas goes into any sort of widespread mainstream use, you will know about it.

And of course we don't need yet another new energy source, just so humanity can carry on as it has. I'll be looking to see how things unfold in the next few years regarding energy in light that the US and German military put out three reports ( total ) in the last year citing severe oil supply constaints beginning during that period which will be causing serious social disruptions across the world. Given the information I have seen, that certainly seems very possible.

Hotspringswizard said...

Max Keiser interview with Dmitry Orlov:

Anonymous said...


Murph and HSW have it right. By way of example, if we did find a new energy source to keep society going where are we going to get the copper or plastic from to plumb new houses? In my opinion there is no alternative but to revert to village life as it was 200 or so years ago.

Re what Mt 2Tuf is doing, he is just doing what plants have been doing since time before mankind. That is making use of the free stuff that is out there in the cosmos and just happens to fall on Earth. That is before we got fancy with ourselves and called it zero point energy. If we don't have to pay for the input, the output is all our own. There is nothing wrong with this just so long as we recognise what is going on.

Re fusion, we know how to do this already. The US did it twice on Japan and many nations at other times that we are not supposed to know about. The problem is containment of the energy once it is made. The sun and stars do it with magnetism but you need a certain mass for this to happen. So far best brains have not come up with a design for a magnetic bottle. Incidentally, it is only hydrogen that is magnetic, helium is not, so one day as the hydrogen is used up there will not be enough magnetism to hold it all together and that is why the sun will go nova. I do not know for sure but it seems probable that sun spots could be bubbles of helium that do not burn and so are colder. They are being heated by the nuclear furnace underneath. CME's could be magnetism that the surface helium can't contain.

Anonymous said...

GD to HSW: back at yer mate, the love is mutual :) I'm relieved you don't want to debate it, time is precious here too ;)

I've been an avid weather nerd since I was knee high to a grass hopper (sailor). When they were warning of the coming "ice age" back in the 70's I said they were FOS back then, I was about 10yrs old! BTW that was the infamous James Hanson back then too, and I'm sure you know what he's up to these days ;) The timing of the furore iceage/CAGW lines up exactly with the 60yr ocean cycles see AMO + PDO etc. which are driven by the amount of energy getting into the seas from the sun (changes in % cloud cover in the tropics) rather than re-radiated energy from Co2, unless you can show me you heat your bathwater with a hairdryer that is

I'd encourage you (and anyone interested in CAGW) to look at the length of sun spot cycles against temps here, simply put longer cycles = la Nina dominates = cooler planet, short cycles = el nino dominate = warmer planet, there is a lag of the effect (5 or 6 yrs from memory) see for details. I sometimes wish I kept a record of the research I read, but then I gave up debating after the last episode with the physicist so never seen much point. is sceptic, but about as even handed of all the blogs on it IMO, the reference pages are data only, no opinion is offered on the ref pages. there's no censoring of comments unlike most of the pro blogs.

Anonymous said...

GD cont...

FA I hear you on the solution to insomnia, I was once a mod hydro guru for yrs on the old gardens cure site before they banned me ;) TPTB in the UK declassified it for a while, then the next bunch in power reclassified it, which doubled the price, these days you can only get wet shyte unless you pay £200 per oz, which just ain't right. Karma my help when I find the right person (in the right circumstances) to pass on my knowledge, personal circumstances mean it would be far too risky here for the foreseeable future. I do indulge when I can though ;)

I don't worry about ocean acidification

My main environmental concerns regard #1 soil errosion, #2 deforestation/biodiversity loss, #3 pollution (including gmo, chemtrails etc. in that order) If you've ever read Bill Mollisons Designers Manual you'd see wher I get it from ;)

Solutions you can use like Permaculture, Regenerative agriculture (which is PC based but includes Holistic management/time controlled grazing, & keyline ploughing etc.) see for local (to you guys) examples...

Randy: seeds of destruction is good, but that's not where I got my GMO views from, mine is intuitive from my research on microbes, aerated compost teas etc. search Dr. Elaine ingham and her site for more info on ACT (which I believe, taken together with is the future of chem free farming)

on weed pulling: if your soil depth/structure is correct and full of the correct soil biota (see above links) the weeds can't out compete the crops, pasture cropping only works if the soil depth etc. is correct, less than ideal means the weeds are better adapted to the soil, compaction is usually the main issue, followed by water retention and soil biota, keyline corrects both, holistic management then works to add in nutrients without re-compacting, we need herbivores in our rotations for it to work on a grand scale, other options include alley cropping, crops between N-S rows of trees (the trees then add the nutrient in the form of leaves every year, timber crop is a bonus - better if it's coppiced too)

re information overload: yeah BTDT! it's one reason I can't follow MCR anymore, mostly I read david ickes headlines page daily to keep up, along with urbansurvival (still subscribe to US) seems to cover most bases without excess research time, I'm usually done on the computer within an hour per day, other days I can get lost trying to get to the bottom of something particular, so it don't always work

Anyone ever look into pulsed electromagnetic field therapy?
here's one machine
the iMRS 2000 is another, I'm considering hiring one to try to help with my back spasms. I rejected surgery as a 50% chance I'll end up in a wheelchair didn't sound worth the risk, looking for alternatives...

Feeling the warmth of the campfire all the way over this side of the pond, feels good peeps :)

Anonymous said...

Nice to see someone else making the link regards banksters and war we recently mentioned


rockpicker said...


Can you think of any haloed institution more readily embraced and defended, yet more deserving of examination?

rockpicker said...

Another piece linking these devastating, phony wars on terror to the banksters, and how the world is awaking to their fraud.

Once a cucumber is pickled...

Anonymous said...

blogger ate the second half of my 5:37 post: GD :(

rockpicker said...

What can we do about all this censorship legislation?

Black March.

murph said...


Found indeed your comment in the spam container. Have un-spammed it. lol.

rockpicker said...

This is awsome.

murph said...


Your last comment back to me on 2tuf implied that he was creating virtual free energy. "As stated in my previous comment, he's dissociating water with solar energy generated from his own site-built panels, so once the panels are up and running, the input energy is basically free, isn't it? "

I assert that NO, it is not free energy, or even close to it. While I have some admiration and a bit of amusement at his back yard tinkering and documenting it, it is not free energy by a long shot and further more, if an attempt is made to scale it to some usable level outside of the workbench demonstration, the "free" part of it becomes even more distant.

When ALL of the costs of producing his hydrogen bang are taken into account I think you will find it is an energy loss.

Let's take a look at the physics and economic data. First, the raw materials have to be produced and sold to make the capture of sun radiant energy available. A vastly inefficient system at best due to the dispersed form of energy it represents. Then we have to have the raw material (all of which are nonrenewable in human terms) to make the devices to capture the results of passing electricity through water to produce the hydrogen. None of this address the problem of storing the hydrogen for future use, its transportation and the physical fact that we have (to my knowledge) no known material to safely store for long term hydrogen in its gas or liquid form. Then we have the problem of safely producing the devices to convert that hydrogen to heat to do mechanical work, all again dependent on non renewable resources.

Yes, we have produced internal combustion engines that can utilize this form of fuel, but who do you know that has the money to buy one of these, they are really expensive and no amount of production line tinkering will make them affordable to the general population since the technology and raw material to make them is so damned expensive.

Palooka, didn't you experiment with retrofitting an engine with something similar a while ago? How did it turn out?

RP, this is not a reply to necessarily make a debate or to take a jab at you. If you can furnish me with data that indicates this is truly a free energy source, I will reconsider. I also am not condemning 2tuf for his efforts, not at all. It is the conclusions that I am questioning.

After all, when I was in high school physics class, I performed the same experiments, although my power source was a wall outlet rather than a solar array, that was the 1950's. We all enjoyed the bangs and woofs of the ignited hydrogen. While our technology has changed considerably, the technology problems of mass use stays the same. If mass use of that power supply on a net energy basis is found, so be it, but to date it has not. And that does not include the huge infrastructure change that would have to accompany it and how to pay for it.

IMO, from all the data I look at, I conclude that the answer to our energy problems is not in putting energy and money into government subsidized experiments for "free energy", but rather in downsizing energy use altogether. This will be vastly painful to our society. But until someone comes up with a truly net energy easily available source than I have so far seen, that solution will be forced upon us in the near future.

Many of the present green energy sources (fusion is a possibility) may serve as transitions to lower energy use, but until they become proven and scalable off the work bench, we need to be down sizing and doing it now to ameliorate the pain of it being forced on us. Whatever comes of the technology advances, the money behind the no change attitude is going to fight it tooth and nail. We do have numerous example of technological changes in the past that saved energy and they were stymied by money interests for the most part.

We shall see

Anonymous said...


I think Murph and me are saying the same thing using different words although Murph went a stage further with his energy audit considerations. Lets take a look at the two methods of getting energy from nuclear tinkering and I am going to keep this as simple as I can. Hydrogen is the simplest element of all. It just consists of one proton or positively charged particle and one negatively charged electron buzzing around this proton in space. Each time another proton is added to the nucleus or centre of the atom this becomes another element. Helium has two protons, lithium three etc. As elements get progressively more protons they can also accommodate neutrons or neutral particles into the nucleus. They don't concern us here and I am not going to talk about them. The number of protons an element has is also called the atomic number, thus hydrogen has an atomic number of one; helium two; lithium three etc. Iron has an AN of 26. All elements with an AN of 26 or less are referred to as light elements. All elements with an AN greater than 82, lead, are referred to as heavy. This has nothing at all to do with their density, just where they fall in the sequence of atomic numbers. Heavy elements are to one degree or another radioactive. This means that their nuclei are unstable, some more than others, and they would prefer to break down to two simpler elements. The combined normal or resting energies of these two elements are less than the energy of the original heavy element from which they were formed, otherwise the process would not work. This is general throughout nature. If you drop a book on the table it is at a lower energy state than when you were holding it up in the air. The process in which heavy elements break down is known as fission and the energy which is released is that which is used to generate electricity. This amount of released energy is a constant for the process and cannot be changed but if it is too strong to generate the required amount of electricity it can me controlled or moderated by placing another material in the reactor to mop up the excess energy. This is usually graphite. Thus we can have a controllable supply of electricity from the breakdown of heavy elements.

Let us look at the other end of the scale. The nuclei of light elements (AN less than 26) can not break down this time but can combine together to form heavier (not heavy as I have just defined it) elements with the release of energy. This process is known as fusion. Most of these elements are everyday substances known to us for a long time and are very stable in their resting states. For example aluminium; magnesium; calcium etc. To get them to fuse you need an initial high input of energy, the famous nuclear trigger. Once the reaction has been triggered it happens instantaneously, the hydrogen bomb I mentioned in an earlier comment for example and it is not controllable. How do you capture and store that amount of energy? Nobody has figured it out yet. It is an attractive sounding process, the starting materials are everywhere and generally relatively harmless. The amount of energy released is phenomenal but the whole problem is one of containment.

The so called cold fusion, beggers description. If it is cold then where is the release of energy? That is why the scientific community is sceptical and waiting for the process to be duplicated by peers.

It is now 4am here, I have insomnia mainly caused by eating a cream cake that was a day too old. This reply has diverted my attention and I am feeling much improved so I will try to get a couple of hours in.


Anonymous said...

better go to ebay and buy some survival seed kits now. shtf soon and the stores will be empty, grow your own.

Hotspringswizard said...

Nina provide a link to this info on US special forces seeking to operate in more places, with more autonomy from the government:

Also another link from Nina. Check out the graphic illustration:

Revealed – the capitalist network that runs the world

Like Randy always says, we are so doomed!

Hotspringswizard said...

Rp, regarding that quake illustration link, you really gotta watch your sound level when that Fukushima quake goes off! Jeeesh! I had to pull my headphones off my ears :-) After watching that accounting of the quakes worldwide for 2011, the Pacific Coast is downright serene compared to those areas from the south pacific island, up through indonesia, and on north past Japan. Besides the Japan quake with its many aftershocks, the amount trend through the year was quite regular, as seen in the graphs shown later in the video.

rockpicker said...


Thank you for that lengthy, and eloquent clarification. I've never heard anyone explain fusion in such clear, concise terms before, and it really does help.

As you may have guessed, a question has arisen.

What if, when you drop the book, you drop it down a very deep well, at the bottom of which, at, or near earth's center, stands the table? What will the book's potential energy portfolio look like when it hits the table?

What role does gravity play in our experience of 'normalcy' in three dimensional space at the surface, and how would a change in gravity alter the behavior of elements?

Anonymous said...

GD ? on "free energy".

what is the Searl effect generator all about?

and this guy...Nuclear Engineer M.T. Keshe explains how a new understanding of physics leads to alternative methods to generate electricity. The presentation was held at the Elektor Live! electronics event held in Eindhoven, Netherlands 26 November 2011.

I remain sceptical, but intrigued non the less.

Anonymous said...

GD: gratuitous plug for my friends new book :)

Anonymous said...


Those are really good and sensible questions Rp. Before anybody gets smart and asks if the book would not burn up before it got more than a mile down, yes it would but let's treat the question in the spirit it was asked. The answer is that it would never get to the bottom of the well. Newton's law of gravity between two objects states that it is directly proportional to the product of the two masses and inversely proportional to the square of their distances apart. We can forget the second part for now and just consider the mass of the earth which for this exercise we will assume to be constant all the way through. To explain it just think of it like this. Imagine a football with a tennis ball held in some way at its centre. The outer diameter of the football is constant but the thickness of its skin can vary inwards, half an inch, one inch, three inches etc. Similarly the tennis ball which is solid all the way through, can get fatter and the two are arranged so that the outer surface of the tennis ball always touches the inner surface of the football. A point must be reached when the mass of the tennis ball is equal to the shell of the football. The gravity of each will cancel the other out and that is where our imaginary book will stop. If you could push it further down it will simply just bob back up. At that point there is no net potential energy acting on the book. Kinetic energy might cause it to oscillate a few times before it came to rest but then this would stop also. You can think of it like a submarine where the weight of the ship plus the seawater ballast equals the upward thrust of the buoyancy.

What role does gravity play in our experience of 'normalcy' in three dimensional space at the surface. I guess what you are asking me is the difference between weight and mass, at least that is what I am going to answer. If you mean something else than please run it past me again. Suppose a pound of iron contained a trillion atoms. It doesn't I just made that up. That trillion atoms has a mass of one pound. If you took it to the moon or Mars it would still be a trillion atoms with a mass of one pound. On Earth the effect of gravity pushes that trillion atoms down on a weighing machine and registers a weight of one pound. If you took the iron and the weighing machine to the moon where the gravity is less, that trillion atoms would register a weight which is less by one pound X gravity on Moon / Gravity on earth. In deep space it would have no weight at all but would still be a trillion atoms with a mass of one pound. Is that what you were asking?

Anonymous said...


How would a change in gravity alter the behavior of elements? In nearly all circumstances it wouldn't. In all reactions what is important is the energy state at the beginning and the energy state at the end and generally this, including radioactive decay, is independent of gravity. The only time I can see where it would make a difference is in the world's large atom smashers, particularly the one at CERN. What they do there is to take an element of interest, spin it around and around until its speed approaches the speed of light. They then apply a huge magnetic field at right angles to the direction of the motion to strip off all the atoms electrons so they are just left with the nucleus. and at an appropriate moment they smash them into some target atoms they are interested in investigating just to see what happens. Einstein's theory of relativity predicts that as an object approaches the speed of light, its weight will tend towards infinity. It is because of this infinite weight that Einstein deduced that no object or force could exceed the speed of light. Having said this, if the force of gravity between the sun and the planets was not instantaneous they would all go flying off into space. No one seems to be talking about this. Standard Theory still has some clunky bits. This gravitational effect of infinite mass may have some bearing on what results are found in these great atom smashers. Gravity and magnetism are the forces that keep stars together but I have never gotten into the physics of this nor black holes. Hawking might throw some light on this if you are brave enough!

Rp, this may interest you.

Not having a credit card I have never bought it but Amazon used to give away a free first chapter which was fascinating and drew you in but not far enough to give the game away.

rockpicker said...


Thanks again for those explanations. I really have little training in such matters, beyond what I can vaguely recall from high school chemistry class.

I did enjoy a short volume on Einstein's theories, and this discussion reminds me of some of his examples. Going back to the book, it seemed to me that as the book approached the earth's center, the effect of gravity on the book would profoundly change, ie., the direction of the force would no longer be confined to a linear attraction oriented towards the center, but as the book fell into the mass, the mass increasing on all sides, relative to the book, would pull on the object from all sides until, at the center, the book would enter a state of equal gravity from all sides, or, essentially, the direct opposite of zero gravity. Omni gravity, if you will.

One of my questions concerned the behavior of atoms in altered gravitational states. You answered that nicely for me. To paraphrase, the electrical bonds of atoms are stronger than the force of gravity, which is what the electric universe guys like to point out.

rockpicker said...


How's about another weather update? We're not hearing a whole lot about your winter over here, but reports we do get suggest parts of Europe are having a tough go. Heard there was snow in Algeria.

rockpicker said...


Since we're talking physics, and you seem not only able but inclined to explain these subjects in a lucid sort of way, any comments on Bearden's scalar electromagnetics?

Any serious discussion of free energy would, I presume, need to include Col. Tom.

Anonymous said...


Babysitting tonight so am using someone else's Mac, hope I get it right. You are right about the book. If it fell from the sky it would accelerate towards the earth according to Newton’s law of Motion - Force = Mass X Acceleration
Acceleration is the normal acceleration due to gravity, so it will get faster as it approaches the Earth’s surface. It is possible for the friction of air resistance to make the rate of descent constant for some objects so it will accelerate until it reaches this so called terminal Velocity. As it enters the well it will start to slow down because the gravitational effect of first the crust and then the mantle and all the sub layers will want to pull it back up but there is still a greater force from the Earths core pulling it in. As it goes further in, the core effect will decrease and the crust effect will increase with the effect that the book will gradually slow down until the two forces are equal and it will come to rest at some distance probably a third of the way to the centre. with as you say gravity acting on it from all directions.

Beardon is a bit too smart for me, he actually leaves me far behind but I will look at the site you put up later. This screen I have up now doesn’t have a min button on the top right so I don’t know how to toggle between screens. I am going to post this and look at the other things later

Anonymous said...


This throw away bit of clarification about the book has started a topic, but hey, that's the way it goes;-) One final word on the book, if you could get it to the centre of the Earth then you would have to find a way of restraining it there . As you say, gravity would act from all sides but the well would give one direction an unfair advantage. And the final thought is that if you could dig such a well, you could never fill it back up again :-)

I put the Beardon page up last night but got called away and didn't go back to it. It looked complicated but one thought came into my head, that there are certain inventions which it is not allowed to patent, perpetual motion; time travel and all forms of life.
Here is a web page from a Beardon detractor who calls himself Skeptoid, which you might find interesting.

The weather is okay now. For two weeks we had this massive high pressure covering between the Eastern Atlantic to the Urals and repelling all borders from the West and North. With no cloud cover temperatures in Belgium got down to 0°F in high Belgium and where we are, a tad south of Antwerp we were protected a bit by the thermal mass of the sea so we had it down to about 12 – 14°F. It snowed a week and a half ago. Only once and about three inches where we are but it left footed the ones who call out the gritter wagons and we had 1400km of gridlocked auto-routes. Sub zero temperatures continued up until Sunday when we had sleet overnight which froze to black ice on Monday morning. I had to go to the village on Monday morning and after 50yards or so I went back home for my crutch which I had previously abandoned. The ice was gone in the afternoon. Yesterday it rained which got rid of the last of the snow but the ground underneath was still frozen so any grassy areas turned into a morass. This coming week we are basking an a balmy 32 – 40°F.

murph said...


This is the most comprehensive report I have seen on the effects of an EMP event over the US. Long and technical read but IMO worth the time.

murph said...

Arrrg forgot the link.

murph said...


That link has some real good sense attached to it.

I figure if you want to assert some idea that contradicts what we think we know of physics principles, you bwetter have some damned good data that is replicable to back it up. Otherwise its science fiction.

rockpicker said...

Yeah, so, the question is, after millions of sightings around the planet, after all the recorded renderings in cave art, chapel paintings, all the written references back to the Bible and the ancient Sanskrit texts concerning vimanas and their wars in the sky, the radioactive skeletons of humans thousands of years old, the sunken cities all over the planet in 100 ft. of salt water that Smithsonian magazine hasn't seen fit to tell you about, after all this real evidence we know is true, but suppressed, the question is, how do these flying saucers defy gravity, change direction at high speed, and operate against the known laws of physics?

I think we've arrived at a point, disclosure or no, where someone's got a lot of 'splaining to do.

We can no longer pretend these craft are merely figments. We diserve our own interests by denying the importance of their existence.

Obviously, what academia has to offer is not adequate.

Like Conan Doyle says, "When all that is impossible has been ruled out, what remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth."

rockpicker said...

Burma Shave

Anonymous said...


Skeptoid didn't say that Beardon's viewpoint wasn't a valid argument. What he said was that it wasn't proved and until such time that it was, it was a matter of choice whether you bought into it or not. In a way, it is a bit like choosing to believe whether God exists or another of Skeptoids arguments, whether a belief in God is necessary to be a moral person. At the moment we are in a position of not knowing. The flat Earther's got it wrong, the ones who said the Earth goes around the Sun got it right. Until such time as the science is proven or disproved then you must accept such arguments as a matter of belief or faith. We are not going to fall out over this but no straw men eh, attacking him for what he didn't say. I will admit he used the word 'nonsense' which was his scepticism taking him a step too far and I think was related to firm conclusions being drawn from an unproven postulation. As for flying saucers being able to defy gravity or instantly change direction, I would guess that would be related to vector technology which introduces a directional component into the argument and is established science.

By the way, we never had Burma Shave on our side of the pond, what does it mean?

Another by the way, it has been reported, I don't know where any more, that the Smithsonian have destroyed ancient artefacts that didn't fit into their world view. They are bad people if they have.
I have just searched “ Ancient artefacts destroyed by Smithsonian” and got masses of hits. They tend to be a bit one sided and inflammatory. Here is one of the milder ones.

Anonymous said...

murph... it was one of my guys and i think it was a bust.

on tesla...

great website btw... p

Anonymous said...

this one's better...






burma shave


rockpicker said...

Max Keiser interviews James Howard Kunstler in this report.

rockpicker said...


Great website, indeed! Check this out.

murph said...

More information on what GMO crops are doing to the environment.

rockpicker said...


What do you want to bet there is some link between Monsanto's gmo Roundup research and Morgellons?

"Scientists have discovered a brand new organism in genetically engineered animal feed, an organism that has since been linked to infertility and miscarriage in cattle, horses, pigs, sheep, and poultry. We can anticipate that, with such a broad spectrum of animal species, which is extremely unusual, that humans will face the same problem, and there has been an increasing frequency of miscarriage and a dramatic increase in infertility in humans in just the last eight to 10 years.

The organism was initially identified by veterinarians around 1998, about two years after the introduction of Roundup Ready soybeans, which is one of the staple feeds. The vets were puzzled by sudden high reproductive failure in animals. While sporadic at first, the phenomenon has continued to increase in severity. Dairies are reporting rates of spontaneous as high as 70 percent.

The cause-effect relationship between high reproductive failure and this new microbial entity has been established, but the research has not yet been published. The reason for the delay is because they really do not know what the organism is. It's not a fungus. It's not bacteria. It's not a mycoplasma or a virus. It's about the same size of a small virus; you have to magnify it 40,000 times."

Anonymous said...

... there is some link between Monsanto's gmo Roundup research and Morgellons?

how dey say it? if it walks like-a, talks like-a, looks...

then it is!

here's what bothers me unforgivingly... by now there must be many folks who work there that know the score as well as many, many folks connected in myriad ways via the network. and it ain't pretty!! i'm not talkin 'bout the evil runnin the show i'm talking about their minions and the grunts. so what keeps them there? any number of things and the situation is consistent across the spectrum of all walks. call it fear, call it survival, call it apathy. call it whatever but call it one of the core shortcomings of we humans. yes, there are likely some who had the courage in the midst of enlightment. but far more likely they are far less than the minority... p

ps, mods... is it just me that finds the new prove-i'm-not-an-idiot... er, i mean robot... to be a real challenge? is it wntorner or is it wntomer farms? i'll pick the first one...

not. try again.

Anonymous said...

rp... leave it to you to bore thru a couple year's worth of reading material to zone in on a most curious gem in less than 24 hours!

quote: Anyone able to manipulate resonant frequencies between five and fifteen cycles per second, to three decimal places of accuracy, can influence every dynamic electromagnetic activity on the face of the earth and beyond, including global weather patterns, human thought and thus human behavior.

and they can cuz its all made up of the same fundamental stuff operating on the same fundamental laws. collectively and elementarly - energy. metaphysics and physics. laws we are only beginning to understand. laws that, when known can be used for both good or evil ends (this is the best and worst argument for free will btw). right now it appears the evil do-ers have the upper hand unless there's some truth to the fiction that would be the munich group. and/or... we just quit helping 'em. like, owning where we're in alignment with them and then doing something to change that... p

freeacre said...

We watched a documentary called "Sophia Returns" with John Lamb Lash (I think that's his name) about the Gnostic cosmology and myth of Sophia. I found it fascinating. Says that the earth is sentient, and that human beings (as well as all living things here) are a part of a sentient being that is our planet. We are like the cells of a sacred being. And, when we follow our inner guidance, we do sustainable things.

But, there are also Archons, who are false forms - not really alive, but mechanical in nature. They create clones and simulations that are poor substitutes for the real things. They confuse us with all these false beliefs. The main one is thinking that we are a part of the "one god" outside of ourselves that required suffering and sacrifice to give us eternal life. Wrong. We are connected to and part of a very special planet - Earth. The earth is a special creation of the goddess, Sophia. She has been observing with great interest what we do with our free will, but will only allow us to go so far before she intervenes.
I think we are just beginning to get a clue about the dynamic potential of the earth, solar system, and galaxy. I am somewhat comforted to think that humankind is not in charge. These exogenous archon created mutant people (psychopaths/reptilians) are doomed to Borg failure, and The Mother is in charge.
I would like to think so. I have to do some meditating on this.

freeacre said...

... Kinda reminds me of "Avatar" when the Na'vi are battling the corporates and just when it looks like they are losing, the living planet sends her other creatures to help the people.

What's with this new word verification format? It sucks.

Anonymous said...

It sucks.

well that sez it alot better than i did!!

fa... over 8 hours combined in 2 TMRN lash interviews. see this 2 page cache...

quote lash... she is the essential and erotic presence of the most awesome magnitude. and she only wants to play.

the divine sophia IS mother god! ...p

Hotspringswizard said...

The earth average temperature have been warming. The period of 2000-2010 was the warmest decade yet on record. During that same period for the US, there were twice as many record highs, as there were record lows. Earth's major ice structures around the world are melting. So some think the warming is not being caused by the increase in greenhouse gases, specifically CO2, but is actually being caused by increasing solar activity. Look at this graph of the solar cycles going back over 250 years:

Specifically note the period from 1850 to present ( the previous 100 years show the same stable trend ), the time during which humanity began to burn hydrocarbon fuels in greater and greater amounts. What do you see? It is, average fluctuating activity with no apparent upward general trends. Now look at CO2 historical data here:

Note the graph halfway down " Full Mauna Loa CO2 record ". Trend line is heading up dramatically and consistently, world temperature is up, and chaotic and extreme weather is on the increase.

Just like scientific data showed that comment Elenin would not affect the earth because it was just to far away ( and no it did not just burn off because of the sun ), data for the sun's activity shows that it has remained stable with typical up and down cycles.

So no I'm not buying the " increased solar activity " narrative for the increasing atmosperic average world wide temperatures and associated severe weather that have been recorded.

Regarding the new word verification process, where does the " please prove you're not a robot " sentence come from? I thought it was put there by Murph and Freeacre. I can generally hardly read the first verification word format.

Hotspringswizard said...

And in consideration of the land earth temperature figures for recent decades, here is a graph which highlights a global warming skeptics view of temperature trends, with a global warming realist view:

Skeptics blue lines, temps going down. Realist red trend line clearly shows temps going up. But I understand clearly that no amount of info, or data will convince some people of CO2's affect on Earth's atmosphere, my Mom being one of these people :-)

rockpicker said...

Data show all the inner planets of our solar system to be warming, not just earth. So, what's going on?

Bill Herbst said...


As you probably know, all my emails to you are returned undelivered, so I'll just check in here and say hello.

Boxes on the Oregon coast? Pure hoax.


murph said...


Good to hear from you again. I have no idea why emails to us would be returned. I haven't heard that from anyone else, at least not yet.

I have been wondering what was going on over those metal boxes on the beaches. I notice that the news reports on them is amazingly lacking anything in meaningful details. It smacks of hoax but we shall see. Lots of reports circulating around on really not very believable stuff going on. Again, we shall see.

I have the observation that most of human society is waiting around for some kind of deus ex machina to save their asses from stupidity.

I very much liked your last posting.

rockpicker said...


Speaking of things happening that are hard to believe, yet, in your face, before God and everbody, check out this speech taped in the House of Lords.

Picked up this link on the Project Camelot website. Hear the numbers this guy is talking?

Hotspringswizard said...

Here is a good way to see just how tumultous Earth's atmosphere really is. Warmer temps = more water vapor = more energetic and extreme weather. Adjust the " image loop " counter up to 10 for a longer view of the movement ( you can move it to higher numbers too ), then click the animate box:

Hotspringswizard said...

The address I listed for the Sat Image did not post completely. At the end where it is ( .h ), it should be ( .html )

murphy said...


If the white hats are going to move, it better be soon or it won't matter much anymore.

Hotspringswizard said...

Paul Craig Roberts nails it once more:

Silencing The Critics

murph said...


That article by Roberts is so right on

Anonymous said...


“I have the observation that most of human society is waiting around for some kind of deus ex machina to save their asses from stupidity.”

I have the observation that most of stupid ass human society is not aware they are attending a show.

rockpicker said...

But, a few of us ARE waiting for that lawn dart!

Anonymous said...

a big reason people are willing to spend a whole paycheck at whole paych... er, i mean whole foods is, in a word, CONFIDENCE! a reasonable confidence that WF does what they say they do - vet their sources. by that i mean they have employees, not independent contractors that do the vetting in the interest of WF's proclaimed committment to their customers.

and then again, maybe not. listen to WF's response to all this...

thats the kind of behaviour and asnwers i'd expect from monsanto!!

rockpicker said...

"We had to destroy the northern hemisphere in order to save it."


rockpicker said...

Anon 10:38;

Excellent piece.

rockpicker said...

Hope we're all around for this film debut.

Anybody else having trouble breathing?

Anonymous said...


Pondering "occupy" and the various "colour revolutions" and what form of protest would be worth even trying, in the face of such well funded state/MSM propaganda. Also Cliff Highs recent conference call with David Icke, where he was looking for a word the "awake" could all associate with each other. Also after reading Richard Heinbergs "the end of growth" and noticing something odd, I had an interesting thought.

We all know the history of the money supply right? How the PTB gained and continue their hegemony (which Heinberg arm waves out the way by calling the Bank of England "nationalised" treating the Fed with the same arm-waving tactic).

What if there was a concerted effort to educate, or just spread a short sentence such as.

Ask your government (any gov globally) why do sovereign people/nations have to pay usery/interest for the privilege of using the means of exchange, and who gets the profit on that usery?

Seems to me the end of this scam would soon solve an awful lot of issues. Yet I don't see any pundits even mention it, even the alternate blogs/news like TAE, MCR, Chris Martenson, Mish shedlock, or even global research?

I can't recall any of the better known "alternative" blogs/media even mentioning it.

Imagine if it was common knowledge worldwide, and a Ghadiesque non-violent movement just kept repeating the question, even if it meant the front liners getting a head bashing from the anti-protest police?

People will flash mob a shopping mall just for giggles, why not silently flash mob every global central bank, or the sq mile in London, a ring of silent folks just holding hands, refusing to even "demonstrate/protest" just stand there silently holding hands. How can the police arrest someone for staying peacefully silent?
Questions would be asked, info would get out, gov would have to respond eventually, and I can't see how they can wriggle out of an answer that excuses usery on the means of exchange.

Maybe I'll email MCR and ask him why he's never suggested it :)

murph said...


The statement you used,"
Ask your government (any gov globally) why do sovereign people/nations have to pay usery/interest for the privilege of using the means of exchange, and who gets the profit on that usery?"

I don't have an exact reference to posts but I have come across this concept many times. I think Charles Smith has expressed it many times and so has The Market Ticker. The question was also raised in 1913 before the formation of the Fed reserve. Lincoln tried to get around it during the Civil War. In a contemporary setting, quite a number of local areas nation wide have attempted to circumvent it, with drastic and draconian interference by the feds.

IMO, it appears that you figure that if enough people ask the question enough times, it would change it. Again, IMO, it wouldn't change anything. The reason? The folks that are in control of this shit storm have absolutely no respect for the bottom 90% of the economic population, zero, respect. That is a well documented attitude by those folks in the top 10%. Even the folks that signed the Declaration of Independence and the framers of the constitution held that attitude. All the signers were moneyed folks and didn't give a shit about the "common man". This is also well documented.

Again, IMO, we have a system of governance that has been taken over pretty much completely with the compliance of the population and trying to fix the system is a waste of time and effort. We need a whole new system of social organization. We need to get rid of the hierarchy system all-together, completely. Hard to overcome over 5000 yrs of hierarchy governance and complacency by populations. Complicit populations will never buy into a system of personal responsibility.

rockpicker said...

Can't recommend Aaron Russo's classic film enough. Everyone should see it.

Wages are not income. Wages represent a trade, or barter, of one's time, energy and skill for some agreed upon compensation.

Income presumes gain, and comes from capital investment.

The Supreme Court has so found. The specific case is cited in the movie.

The IRS commissioner tells us "what the supreme court rules is not relevant to the IRS."

Breath-taking arrogance!

The reason this country pays a private consortium of powerful banks, (the 'federal' reserve,) interest on the money supply is because the government of the U.S.A. went bankrupt, and these private industrialists and financiers bailed it out, with certain stipulations. Control of the money supply and the setting of interest rates became the fed's bailiwick.

Ask yourselves, why does the only organization with the right to print U.S. currency need workers to take money out of their pockets and send it back to the printing press? Does that make sense?

It's not about money.

You put a ring in a bull's nose for control.

rockpicker said...

Hey, hey! We could be having a significant WTF moment! Check out the latest on Kerry's blog.

rockpicker said...

Had a friend tell me the other night she could not believe, it was just too heinous to consider, elements within our own government were responsible for 9/11.

We're ruled by insane dogs...

rockpicker said...


You seen this?

Anonymous said...

GD: Murph, yeah I know the history, from the BOE/FED right down to the hermetic code and back up through Pythagorean "secret knowledge" the circle of primes etc.

I meant that it's not knowledge in the mainstream, hardly anyone I speak to about it understands it even at the basic usery level, and it doesn't seem like there's any effort to get it out there. I may just be clutching at straws with my idea though.

I think any violent mass "protest" no matter what the aim will be crushed, I think TPTB want it that way to enact a police state. I don't know weather I'm prepared to accept any forms of mass non-violent protest would be futile though, not yet.

rp, not seen that particular vid, though I have read a lot of Fulfords work over the yrs.

re the mass resignations, I wonder if they're all off to their underground bunker! interesting times!

rockpicker said...

pretty good ufo flick

Anonymous said...


Game Dog wrote “...a Ghadiesque non-violent movement...why not silently flash mob every global central bank, or the sq mile in London, a ring of silent folks just holding hands, refusing to even "demonstrate/protest" just stand there silently holding hands. How can the police arrest someone for staying peacefully silent?”

It has been done mate, at least the last part of what you said and it got the people didly squat. It was known as The White March and was not wrt central banks though, it was related to paedophilia, particularly in Belgium. Here is a very brief Wiki on it which gives the bare outlines. I can give you another reference to it but that is serious reading. Essentially, what happened is that Mark Doutroux supplied kidnapped children for elite sex and snuff parties. In effect he was the equivalent of your street corner drug pusher. On the third time of looking, police found two kidnapped girls in a concealed compartment within the cellar of Doutroux's house. Doutroux was arrested and a legal process was begun under the supervision of Chief Prosecutor Connorotte (pronounced Connery). He was a no nonsense person whose aim was to expose the whole paedo network and not just the supplier, even if it meant banging up Belgium's nobility and parts of the Royal household. There were hints it went that far. Clearly these things could not be allowed to happen and the elite pyramid sat on the process with its squat base. Connorotte attended the same social function where unbeknown to him the two rescued children were also present and someone introduced them to him. He was accused of conflict of interest and bias and was sacked from the case, to be replaced with someone 'safe'. The public smelled a rat and on on a certain day in 1996, 3% of the Belgian population marched through Brussels protesting corruption within the police, the justice system and the political system. They demanded Connorotte's reinstatement but they didn't get it. The march was silent. All the marchers wore or carried something white. This stemmed from the fact that the widow of the old King wore white at his funeral as a symbol of hope in place of the more usual black. Doutroux was thrown to the lions, all further investigations were stopped and the elite breathed a sigh of relief.

As for not arresting people for standing silently and holding hands, the participants in theory could be arrested for obstruction. You only have to obstruct the bit of ground you are actually standing on. But, hey, laws are for the benefit of all.

Anonymous said...

GS: SATS I remember the case, I didn't get the details regarding how the investigation was thwarted tho, thks.

What if the "silent protest" was organised against the inevitable "violent protests" that will come? Wouldn't the police be on side with the peaceful folks after a period of dealing with the violent folks? I know, more straws (sigh)

Back to localisation then?

Anonymous said...


Game Dog, I know from past comments that you are not afraid of a difficult read. What I am going to give you is probably the most difficult I have attempted. Even though I was aware who many of the players were I frequently got lost and had to re-track. It really is a most incredible piece of research. This particular piece was from a site which was taken down. Another blogger thought it was too important to loose and embedded the whole of the original site into his own site so I will have to tell you how to find it, there is no direct link I can give you.

Do a search for WikiSpooks Main Page and open the link.

On the left hand side, underneath the triangle logo open the category Miscellaneous near the bottom.

At the bottom of the drop down menu open ISGP Archive.

Open the link ISGP archive site – Index page

You are now in the ISGP archive and you will see four grey menu boxes on the LHS
In the fourth box from the top open and read the first two items Beyond Dutroux and Le Nebuleuse.

This will take you a few days at least, some items are book length and complicated. If you are not totally rubbed out after this and are brave enough for more then go through the items in the third menu box in any order.

Good luck.

murph said...

GD and all,

Survival acres has some new posts up. If you go there to read his stuff, be sure to click on the where you will most definitely get more. In his posting on protests, GD, take a look at his observations on protests historically and today.

Now personally, I have been following these posts for years and I agree with his observations almost 100% and agree with his conclusions around 90%. Among his observations that I agree with totally is that we have become a fascist state and so has most of the rest of the world. I also agree with him about what individuals need to be doing. The problem is that few will, and most can't. I am not quite convinced that absolutely nothing can be done to change things around, but admit it is a very slim chance.

This latest post at Survival Acres is worth the read.

murph said...

hmmm blogger left out my "more" to click on

rockpicker said...


You might get a kick out of perusing both this:

and this:

rockpicker said...

From David Wilcock's site, section 8:


As our excerpt continues, we learn about Executive Order 11110 -- which may very well have been the final straw that led to John F. Kennedy's open, public assassination.

The potential of this agreement led to Executive Order 11110, issued July 1963, which would have provided the Department of the Treasury with the power to issue United States Dollars. [This, of course, would destroy the Federal Reserve.]

Within two weeks after signing the Green Hilton Agreement, which would have then enabled consolidation of EO 11110, Kennedy was assassinated... With the death of Kennedy, the authority granted to the Treasury was never taken up….

The assets were placed into the International Collateral Combined Accounts that form the Global Debt Facility.

While an apparently innocuous document to read, in its proper and full interpretation, The Green Hilton Agreement is one of the most profound agreements made between Presidents of any two countries within the twentieth century -- and most probably, in the history of the world.

[This is] particularly so, as this agreement was made between a President of the United States and the Trustee of the hidden, but combined wealth of the world.

These assets are not the property of the United States, but centralized assets under the authority of a centralized system -- to be used as independently deemed to be for the better benefit of the World."

Anonymous said...

GD...rp: I remember talking to Businesman (remember him from the old FTW/MCR blog comments?) about EO 11110 a couple of yrs ago (we're still in contact) he spent a lot of time investigating JFKs assassination, even went to Dallas and checked out the depositary (now a museum I think) looked at all the angles, he concluded there would have been a much easier shot as the cavalcade was approaching, rather than waiting to take the much more difficult (almost impossible) shot that was supposed to have been taken.

I sent him a link to this video

the relevant bit...

"in 1980 Regan was elected after an assasination attempt on Jimmy Carter, which was not widely reported (A newsweek article is shown as a slide), after asking for TV time in the late spring of 1979 to announce sweeping changes in government, including curtailing the CIA, but then he goes to LA and is attacked by "Raymond Lee Harvey" & "Ozwaldo Ortez" the press conference never happened!

I said at the time there's no way the names could have been coincidence.

SATS, I will check out those links, as you say, it could take some time!

Anonymous said...

Murph, think you meant this one...

Do we just give in, give up, and STFU getting back to the garden?

btw, I, GD, stopped posting on the internet in 1989. It has come to my attention my dog has stolen my identity, she has been beavering away at my keyboard all these years setting me up! ;)

murph said...


I tried to get into the reading you recommended and could not find it. Nothing about, Beyond Dutroux and Le Nebuleuse, that I could find. Nothing about those names on the left side. Help lol

murph said...

GD I think,
Nope, I mean the Feb. 22 posting at

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